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New in Toronto real estate: The St. Clements

Posted by Robyn Urback / October 11, 2012

st clements lofts torontoThe St. Clements is supposed to be about old and new, stainless steel and stained glass, and — oh, and, uh, a $5,000 deposit. A Sonterlan Corporation project in association with Brad J. Lamb Realty, The St. Clements is a new condo project set inside (and beside) the historic St. Clement's Church on Jones Avenue in Leslieville. The church itself will house 18 (mostly two-storey) condo lofts, with a (to-be-constructed) modern building right beside with room for another 22. Gothic and new, and connected by a two-storey glass bridge — like a fairy tale, isn't it? Here's a closer look at The St. Clements.

st clements torontoSPECS

Address: 173 Jones Ave

Exterior: Heritage church and modern addition

Number of floors: 4

Number of units: 40 (18 in the church, 22 in the addition)

Unit sizes (in square feet): 613 - 1339

Ceiling height: Up to 9'

Price range $342,900 - $790,900

Parking: $29,000 (For units 775 sq. ft. or larger)

Locker: $3,500

Maintenance: $0.52/ sf

Maintenance fees exclude: Hydro and water

Architect: Turner Fleischer

Amenities: N/A

Expected occupancy: June 2014

st clements real estate torontoTHE GOOD

On the one hand, it's nice to see a century-old Leslieville landmark preserved in such a way that it will garner daily admiration (if only from its inhabitants, but nevermind). On the other hand, I wouldn't exactly call another condo project (especially in Toronto's fatigued real estate market) terribly romantic. But hey — at least it's not a Tim Hortons! Sorry Allenby Theatre. And despite the inevitable naysayers, I still think it is pretty cool to be able to own a piece of a historic Toronto property. And yes, in case you were wondering, the Kool-Aid at the sales centre launch was delicious, thanks.

The suites themselves boast a rarity in terms of Toronto new builds: actual space. While some other hilarious projects will have suites as small as 278 square feet (those guys at Concert Properties sure are jokers), St. Clements lofts start at a very reasonable 613 square feet. And the prices aren't too bad either (keeping in mind that the project officially launched less than 24 hours ago, and probably will rise). Depending on the unit, of course, you could be looking at paying somewhere around $560 to $600 per square foot, which isn't too bad considering the cost of some of the other condos on the market.

The area, too, seems the perfect example of still-growing-but-not-done. A little further south and you'll find yourself in the terribly trendy part of Leslieville that comes with prices that reflect the terribly trendy. And a little further north, you're in Gerrard Square Mall territory, which is probably a ways away from a significant urban upgrade (some like to call it "gentrification" ...whatever). Here you're bound to catch the waves from lower Leslieville without paying the literal prices. In terms of transportation, there's the Jones Avenue bus and Gerrard Streetcar a step away, plus Queen Street not more than a 10-minute walk. And while there's not a whole lot in terms of shopping or eats on Jones Avenue proper (it'll come), there's still more than enough close by.

st clements real estate torontoTHE BAD

Time to get real, unfortunately. While the St. Clements Church does provide a lovely-looking shell, that's all it is. A shell. All suites — including those in the church — will have 9' smooth ceilings. Yes, the stunning wood cladding of that pitched roof interior will be covered to make room for flat ceilings and hanging Home Depot pendants. You're pretty much getting a conventional modern condo with an extraordinary exterior. But inside, it's all the same. And lest we forget the 22 units that aren't even in the church itself, what do you call those? Heritage by association? I'm not sure. But it does strike me as significantly less awesome (a realtor term, I'm sure) to live in an "inspired contemporary building" beside a heritage property than actually inside a heritage property.

Many of the units, too, come with a few significant limitations. For one, most of the "heritage loft" suites (read: the ones in the church) have only a French balcony, if a balcony at all. The reason is obvious, of course, but it's nevertheless a limitation for those who can't imagine a summer without an excess of meals made on the barbeque. The "modern lofts" on the other hand, all offer balconies or garden patios, but many of the bedrooms (as laid out in current plans) are positioned without windows. Apparently, sliding doors are supposed to suffice instead. I'm not amused.

st clements real estate torontoTHE VERDICT

Depends largely on what you've vowed to never do inside a church.

What do you think? Would you live here? Add your comments to the thread below.

Read other posts in this series via our Toronto Condos and Lofts Pinterest board

Discussion

23 Comments

Adam / October 11, 2012 at 09:33 am
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9 foot I mean, oops
CREWMEN & Co. / October 11, 2012 at 10:08 am
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Our clients like to throw parties and a balcony is a must if you have smokers (Cough) or just want that little bit of fresh air while sipping down martinis. No balcony is a deal breaker for most. We'll check out the website and take a look at the modern suites instead. They are after all "Heritage by association."

CREWMEN & Co.
Cyril Sneer / October 11, 2012 at 10:41 am
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4 images of the building, *ONE* image of a kitchen table. Show me what the goddamn suites look like.
aramartis / October 11, 2012 at 10:49 am
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I NEVER GO TO CHURCH.
Max / October 11, 2012 at 11:10 am
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As a late twenty-something doing my hard time downtown so I can go live successfully somewhere quiet you will never convince me that buying a piece of a building is a good idea. I want a whole building, to myself. And if I have to leave Toronto to do it - I will.
I'll spend my $500,000 on a nice chunk of land somewhere, thank you Brad Lamb (Freed, et al.)
It's too bad they couldn't incorporate more of the church because... it would be hilarious to say you'd done *those things* in the private of your own home AND a church.
Tom replying to a comment from Max / October 11, 2012 at 12:03 pm
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And people like Max remind me that north Americans are spoiled brats.
Ratpick replying to a comment from Max / October 11, 2012 at 12:24 pm
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I agree with you, Max.

I'll happily rent a shoebox. But I sure wouldn't BUY one and only own the right to use/sell the air between the walls (plus the building's inevitable liabilities).

When the current generation of condo buyers decides to have families, look for them to flee en masse.
Angry / October 11, 2012 at 12:50 pm
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Grrr! I hate all condos! Grrr!
The Real Johnson / October 11, 2012 at 01:39 pm
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I'll second that. I can't wait for both you and Ratpick to finish up your hard time here in the big scary city so you can both move out to Burlington.

As a condo owner, I can tell you, it is quite harrowing. Where, for example, do I put my lawnmower??
X / October 11, 2012 at 01:41 pm
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I live down the street from here, and I'm glad to see someone's doing something with the place. (Something that doesn't involve throwing up 15+ floors of condo monstrosity.)

It's properly scaled for the neighbourhood and, as the author pointed out, the unit sizes aren't insanely small. Consider my thumbs up.
Ratpick replying to a comment from The Real Johnson / October 11, 2012 at 01:51 pm
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Well, you sure told me! Hmpf! Out to Burlington I go, I guess.

Whatever works for you, friend. I'm doing some woodworking in my garage this weekend, if you want to join. You can also help me can the last of the tomatoes.
The Real Johnson replying to a comment from Ratpick / October 11, 2012 at 01:58 pm
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You had me at "woodworking." See you Saturday morning!
cathie / October 11, 2012 at 02:07 pm
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Shame, shame, shame on the builder/refurbishers of this building. Covering up the wood beams? hello? what's wrong with you, that could/should be your main selling point. Don't they teach you this stuff in architectural/design school? Otherwise, its just another stupid box. Hopefully you will at least leave them untouched so that someday someone will be able to expose them as they should be.
Niklas replying to a comment from Ratpick / October 11, 2012 at 02:57 pm
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huh? You are renting a condo but would never buy one? What's the difference? Besides that owning is always better..
Smeri replying to a comment from Niklas / October 11, 2012 at 03:22 pm
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I'm not against buying a condo, but I'd like to point out that buying is not always better especially a condo. Condo's have a very crappy resell value. Nobody wants to pay for a used condo! So unless you're buying for life, you'll get screwed eventually.
Simon replying to a comment from Max / October 11, 2012 at 03:22 pm
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Makes sense...pay a load of cash to someone else so that you can be responsible for their property and temporarily live there. Looks like you're still figuring things out, kiddo.

In the meantime, this definitely looks like a rush job (the building AND the article). Neither looks like they were very well thought out and had a conclusion in mind before any attention was paid to the details.
cathie / October 11, 2012 at 03:54 pm
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I'm in agreement with Max. Never thought I would be an advocate of renting over owning but with the state of the Toronto condo market I think renting makes sense. Monthly fees are only going to go up, up and up as the building ages. Nobody wants a one-bdrm in a 20-yr old building that needs a ton of work and fees of $700+ per month. We're seeing those now and they are sitting unsold. Most of these dime-a-dozen new condos are built like crap and will have major structural issues in a few short years (see the recent Toronto Life article on that problem). This particular building looks like it falls in that category. Far better to put that money into a dwelling - i.e. single family or townhouse - that you own outright.
Ratpick replying to a comment from Niklas / October 11, 2012 at 04:04 pm
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"You are renting a condo but would never buy one? What's the difference? Besides that owning is always better.."

How old are you kiddo? Do I need to explain?



Gloria / October 11, 2012 at 04:08 pm
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People don't have garages or tomato gardens in Toronto?
edward replying to a comment from CREWMEN & Co. / October 11, 2012 at 04:44 pm
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so - a balcony is for 'parties and smokers'. You've just lost those of us still hunting for a home who think a balcony is for plants and reading. This is (supposedly) a quiet area away from the 905 eurotras strip, but, alas - they are ubiquitous, and you can't run, can't hide, from trash.... I've now put "Crewmen and co" on my list of horrors to avoid.
Mike / October 12, 2012 at 12:06 pm
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Nice idea and could be a very cool spot to live, but agree with the article that not keeping the original roof and as many of the original church details as possible (minus the exterior) is a miss. The Abbey Lofts in Roncesvalles is so nice because they worked the units into the original building without mucking about too much.
Sally / October 17, 2012 at 08:29 pm
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Balcony and original roof. YES I think there should be some mention that this condo development is totally unconnected to the world famous school for girls on 21 St. Clements Avenue, Toronto, Ontario M4R 1G8 which is a shame actually because its the first thing I thought and had to look at the address.
Calgary Roofing / January 21, 2013 at 03:07 am
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What a fantastic place - a rooftop dream for roofers.

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