City
It's a transit platform, it's bike lane, it's a...?
So it's pretty much Roncesvalles day on blogTO. Along with taking a tour of the yet-to-be-completed construction with Rob Ford and members of the BIA this afternoon, I also spent some time checking out the new transit platforms that have been installed on the street. For whatever reason I've become more and more interested in urban infrastructure of this nature and ever since hearing about these, I've been curious to see just what the finished product will look like (in fact, it's the main reason I made the visit today).
What are they and what do they do? As Joshua Tusin noted in his post on them last year, transit platforms "are meant to facilitate smooth boarding on the new streetcars" and will "make things safer for pedestrians." They accomplish this by eliminating the need to step onto the road when entering and exiting streetcars (something which is crucial for those with mobility devices).
But therein lies some of the criticism these have received from cyclists. Although the north/south entrances to the platforms are sloped so that cyclists can easily ride on them (and thus not in the line of the streetcar), concern has been expressed over potential confusion over who these platforms belong to - pedestrians or cyclists. For my part, however, I suspect that signage (to come in spring) will ensure that people shouldn't be confused.
It seems rather obvious that when passengers are boarding the streetcar, cyclists must cede the right of way to them. That's the same as it would work on a street without a platform. Where it might get a little dicey is with people who ignore or disobey the instructions. In the absence of a platform, it's extremely rare to see folks standing out on the street waiting for the next vehicle. That lane, after all, is the domain of cars, and even when it's busy, people tend to value their personal safety enough to wait on the curb.
But the question is whether or not this will be the case when the threat of collision is reduced. Because bikes are quieter, less dangerous and (mostly) a less frequent source of traffic along this stretch, it wouldn't surprise me to see prospective passengers using the platforms while waiting for streetcars that have yet to arrive.
That's of course speculation -- and a skeptical bit at that -- but if you've ever been riding a bike and had a pedestrian shoot off the sidewalk into your path without looking, you're probably also of the belief that cyclists are often low on their radar.
But here's the thing: so what? If ideas were abandoned because of the potential that people might not follow instructions, that'd put a pretty serious damper on innovation. The real test will come in the early summer when construction is (hopefully) complete and all forms of traffic increase along Roncesvalles, but so far these transit platforms look okay to me.


Discussion
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Are there plans to expand these to other streets?
Roncesvalles is no safer/faster than it was 2.5 years ago.
Then the cyclist will continue on in the bike lane, get doored in the collarbone and run over by a truck.
But poor, mean Toronto likes to reinvent everything on the cheap and on the ugly, undermining whatever goal they were trying to pull off and giving ammunititon to the haters (see: St. Clair, Spadina, garbage cans, Yonge Dundas square, bike lanes, tree pits....)
These little asphalt platforms are symbols of a much bigger disease.
To be fair it's not easy to resolve these things. Streets are complicated. What's confusing about these platforms is the long approach, which I guess is necessary because of back door egress form the streetcars. If the City's smart they'll yellow paint "caution bike lane" or something to that effect on the extended platform. Otherwise - collision city!
Expect to see BMX types and skateboarders hopping off the platform into the street.
At the High Park Blvd/Fermanagh Ave TTC stop on the east side going north:
a)people standing on the bike/asphalt section staring at their smart phones not moving when I have riden through.
b)the produce store’s 6 (or 8?) garbage bins are neatly placed by the city on the bike/asphalt section every night after pick up, blocking the lane.
c)a car parked at the entrance to the bike/asphalt section to go get food at the Friendly Thai, blocked cyclists but more importantly blocked a streetcar for 5 minutes, and when he came out to leave yelled expletives to everyone as opposed to remorse for holding up traffic.
At other TTC stops along the street cars have been parked at both entrances & exits to bike/asphalt lane, at various times.
I can’t wait for real snow to fall and what happens when there is a huge pile of snow from snowplows at the entrance to the bike/asphalt sections, I have ridden in the winter in the past it hasn't been a problem to ride down the street.
I have to disagree with you Derek on people standing on the street looking for streetcars or the huge mass that gather on the road as it approaches, no seems to head the rule that your supposed to stay on the sidewalk until the doors open.
From the TTC website http://bit.ly/fHbhZr:
Customers who enter the roadway before the streetcar has stopped and opened its doors can be fined $28.00
I’m not confident that the general public will understand not to stand on the asphalt while waiting for streetcars, nor will people not try to squeeze their cars into places they shouldn’t park, forcing riders into the street.
If everyone was aware and worked together the street would work, but I doubt it. I guess time will tell.
i've already once been held up on the streetcar because a car has parked too close to the starting of the platform, thus making the streetcar unable to pass, so i can't imagine when the street eventually gets busier what it would be like.
also, what will happen when a streetcar brakes down? there are quite a few stops North and South on Roncesvalles, so there are quite a few of these taking over the respective right lanes. People won't be able to weave past a broken car without major headaches.
Lastly, when the street was finally reopened in early December, i read in a Globe & Mail article that bike lanes will also be coming. How is that possible?
Did they change the plans and the Globe was misinformed, or did the planners plan a "super street" with wide sidewalks, transit platforms, bike lanes, and who knows what else, only to realize that it's impossible on Roncesvalles.
;)
The Globe article was incorrect. Roncesvalles is too narrow for proper bike lanes. There's been a fair bit of confusion surrounding the bike ramps at transit platforms. Lots of press confuse or conflate the ramps with lanes.
For the most part, biking on Roncesvalles will be exactly as before: bike beside a row of parked cars. Biggest real difference IMO: a smooth ride! Finally!
Also, denote the platforms as bike lanes and only allow people to use them for boarding and alighting, after that they must stand clear.
I also ride the TTC every day and my streetcar stop is the one above with the mown-down sign. My point was that these rampy things are extremely poor design. They WILL catch outsider motorists off guard, so heads up!
Right over your head
You should try driving a car down Roncesvalles. Those rampy bumpy things are almost invisible from the P.O.V. of a motorist, especially one who has never seen such a structure before.
Forward-thinking urban planners have not always been right, you know.
In the renders from back in 2007 they clearly portrayed these bump-outs as being concrete sidewalk extensions with a little ramp & gully for bikes to pass through.
These things look really cheap - not the kind of thing businesses signed up for when they decided to endure 2 years of construction for supposedly a gorgeous streetscape.
I still think these, and the idea of bringing the curb to the streetcar on a functioning street of mixed traffic, will fail. They're trying to accommodate 5 elements: motorists, streetcars, wheelchair accessibility, cyclists AND pedestrians. I say pick 3 or maybe 4 of those elements and do it right.
Those bump-outs are yet again another real stupid urban planning mess! Sorry cyclists,
I would have rather they used a portion of the widened sidewalk as a dedicated bike lane for you, so as to keep you safer. But alas, that would have been way to easy I guess.
Yes, the Roncesvalles bump-outs/bike lane is the experiment for the rest of Transit City.
Can you believe it. They want to put these suckers all over the place. I hope that Mayor Ford's insistence to re-design TC will omit them, now that he has seen these ridiculous eyesores for what they really are. A USELESS MESS!
Gord Perks should spend a year working with sub-division builder.....he may then learn a thing or two. Until then, wishful thinking blunders is all he is capable of.