Eat & Drink
LCBO Coming to Roncesvalles Area
People love living in Roncesvalles and people love their beer, wine and liquor, but shopping at an LCBO will only require leaving the neighbourhood for one more year.
The LCBO has decided to open up shop in the plaza at the southeast corner of Dundas and Bloor, alongside a Loblaws and Zellers. If all goes according to plan, Roncesvalles residents will be able to walk for their wine in spring or summer of 2010 - most likely before their street is done being dug up.
The chosen location is, admittedly, not exactly in the Village, but a site further south along Roncesvalles was eliminated due to a number of issues: retail floor space, storage, deliveries and parking all being cited. The Roncesvalles BIA has long lobbied for an LCBO to serve its residents and seems satisfied that the final location is accessible enough, even if the government-run monopoly isn't right in the neighbourhood. I can only assume the nearly 300 members of the Facebook group "petitioning" for a Roncesvalles LCBO will also be pleased.
Ultimately, the LCBO is happy to be opening up in the plaza. "We're looking forward to opening at this location," says LCBO VP Jackie Bonic. "It will enable us to provide the community with a larger LCBO store with greater product selection, a wide range of services and ample parking for customers who choose to drive."
Bonic also noted that the proximity to Loblaws allows shoppers to combine grocery and beverage shopping trips into one. Maybe the LCBO is hoping that they'll get extra business from Loblaws shoppers, but with a giant No Frills at Dundas and Lansdowne, perhaps it will be the relatively small Loblaws hoping to see more business from LCBO customers.
The new store will feature 5,600 square feet of retail space with an extensive product selection, including a Vintages area and large VQA selection. Plus, for last minute runs, there will be plenty of refrigerated bottles.
It's safe to say that Roncesvalles residents will embrace the opportunity to more easily access wine and spirits. Will it be a pedestrian destination, stop on the streetcar or a short drive? I'm guessing the latter.
And as one resident has already suggested, perhaps it will be time to add a signal to the parking lot entrance and exit with the added traffic a large-scale LCBO is certain to bring.
Map image created by Dale Fallon.
Discussion
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OH BOY! I hope they stock up on PBR!
In addition, the new location at the SE corner of King and Spadina is well under construction to fill in the hole in that area.
There was an LCBO located for many years in the plaza at the northeast corner of Bloor and Dundas W. It has only been without an LCBO in the neighborhood for 6 years.
It is indeed a wonderful life.
This just made my day!
What a fantastic map!! How did you make one like that, showing the hole in LCBO coverage? I can think of a few other things I'd like to map that way.
I didn't make it, Dale Fallon did. I'm adding a credit to the post above.
http://on-theball.blogspot.com/
That's still a looooooong, bleak walk for most people in the southern part of the neighbourhood.
People who have kids and want to buy wine will probably still drive to a Loblaws with an LCBO outlet in it, rather than cart kids all the way to Bloor. Local shops lose out.
It's bad city-building.
Are they just moving in to the existing plaza? I thought I heard some talk of tearing the whole thing down and redeveloping the site with a mix of retail and residential... or did I just make that up?
Also that Zellers is long gone, isn't it?
With so many other stores doing so well without parking logs along Roncesvalles (including a Sobey's), you'd think that they'd have learned that it's not critical. At least they're getting one. I visit friends there every week and the only option has been the beer store.
Why does the LCBO assume that everyone drives? They chose that plaza because of the parking lot, nothing more. Don't they know that people in that area use the streetcar and subway to get around. They couldn't put one where people transfer from one streetcar to another? No, we have to go home, then go by car to get a bottle.
Just try to buy a 5ยข plastic bag from the LCBO, they don't have any whenever I ask.
"People who have kids and want to buy wine will probably still drive to a Loblaws with an LCBO outlet in it, rather than cart kids all the way to Bloor. Local shops lose out."
There will be a Loblaws right by it..."Bonic also noted that the proximity to Loblaws allows shoppers to combine grocery and beverage shopping trips into one."
The Zellers re-opened after a bit of construction. The Loblaws got a bit of a makeover as well.
It will also be across the street from the Subway, which is a huge convenience for commuters. I think its more accessible to more people being closer to Bloor. Its also a 5600 square foot LCBO, where on Roncesvalles would be able to facilitate such a space other than the plaza? I also would much rather be able to go to the grocery store, and then pop next door for a bottle of wine rather than getting groceries and walking a few blocks for the LCBO.
Jen, yes I saw that. There's a Loblaws close by. But to WALK from Loblaws to the corner, you have to cross a huge, filthy (in winter) parking lot with no sidewalks. Jane Jacobs would hate it.
The LCBO should be located in the neighbourhood retail strip, not near a derelict mall that frankly, few of my neighbours ever go to.
Maybe I'm just fed up. This new LCBO will be just as far a walk for me as the Parkdale one.
Isn't there already one between Howard Park and Roncey on Dundas?
On the south side, across from the stained glass place?
That's a beer store and it's tiny and doesn't have a great selection.
That's a Beer Store. Most useful site, ever, for boozers: http://www.beerhunter.ca/
Great link Vic!
It would have been SO much better to take over the old Rogers video.
Also, anyone else noticed how "roncesvalles-centric" BlogTO is?
Not that I'm complaining..
I assume that's the second location that was in contention, but I can't confirm it.
@Ratpick: I agree. The LCBO isn't interested in neighbourhood or community building or they would have chosen something right in Roncesvalles. The foot traffic would keep them busy everyday, for sure.
Prrince is right though...the old Rogers Video would have been a perfect spot. Probably not big enough though.
The spot in the strip bar would not only service Ronceys, but also encompass Bloor st and all the new condos that are going up between Dundas West and Lansdowne.
LCBO is more concerned with maximum accessibility rather than neighbourhood quaintness, and esthetics.
It is hilarious to know that there is damn near nothing that can be posted on BlogTO without being complained about. Its a bloody new LCBO in a clearly (thanks for the map) lacking area. This is a fantastic and well thought out location for one. Tons of room, parking, and proximity to the subway station. Perfect. This isn't a "driver's only" LCBO as some have claimed, I walk to that Loblaws all the time for groceries, its quite accessible.
Can we not just all be happy for once? Apparently a few of you may need that liquor store sooner than later.
Hahah...I meant stip mall...must have had house of lancaster on the brain for a minute
And tell me again why the LCBO/Beer Store monopoly is a good idea? Great that they're getting an LCBO, but...
lala, Prince, I can assure you that the old Rogers store location would likely be higher or equal rent, for a fraction of the space and no parking, is it really that big of an issue for it to be a wee bit further up the road?
I agree that the location makes a lot of sense. I regularly walk to that area with two young children, and not only is it fine for accessibility, it's not as far as other people make it out to be. If you think it's too far, then use the available parking that the location will be providing! Besides, I'd prefer to see small businesses along Roncy - not large-scale government run ones.
Eric, it's OK to complain. Ontarians are pretty much the only people in the Western world who think it's normal to walk 45 minutes (in the middle of a big city) to grab a bottle of wine to go with dinner. Elsewhere in the world, they just go to a grocery store.
If you think that's great, good for you. Personally, I won't bend over and take it -- at least, not without complaining.
I would love to be able to walk to the corner store to buy a bottle of beer/wine alas in Ontario we are not afforded the option. Does it suck? Of course. Am I going to change that by complaining about it on a blog site? I suppose I'm just exhausted with people seemingly always finding something to complain about here, and low and behold now I'm complaining about complainers.
Piss.
Maybe, just maybe, Ontario should liberalize its liquor laws so that private retailers can sell alcohol. People from other countries and even other provinces are shocked when they can't go to the store for a bottle of wine or a six-pack after 9 pm (6 on Sunday!). And as Ratpick said above, even within those hours, there isn't a liquor store a block or two away, but maybe a mile or two away.
What a ridiculous nanny-state anachronism the LCBO is.
Eric SAYS what I FEEL! Sometimes the comment cattiness is a super downer.
According to the map, East of Queen and Dufferin appears to have pretty good concentration of LCBO locations. Funny how right next to it is an empty space. The SimCity player in me is seething.
I wonder where the exact location of the new LCBO store will be. Are they building a new building, or taking over an unused building? The parking lot is HUGE so they could fit the LCBO anywhere they want.
The bad part of the LCBO being in the plaza is that it lacks the charm of being in Roncy's, but if the store was in Roncy's it would have to be small which reduces the selection.
Maybe in the long term, the addition of the LCBO will bring in some nicer stores on the stretch from Dundas West to Bloor
I don't get it -- there is an entire city plan to rip that plaza down...
I'm still furious that the Ontario government didn't approve that bill to de-regulate the sale of Ontario wines..
How perfect would it be to be able to at least get a bottle of local wine at the store rather than walking/driving to a govmt. LCBO location during the hours within which the nanny state says I can eat dinner.
Also, that flies right in the face of helping us support a self-sustaining industry.
Throttling competition is a feature for certain large corporations. I suspect that's more of a factor in the continued LCBO/Beer Store monopoly than the nanny state, but I may be wrong.
That's really fantastic news!
There is plan about that area but nobody really knows what is going to happen and it may take years. Whatever happens there will be retail involved so we will be safe.
This is the greatest day of my life. (almost)
"The new store will feature 5,600 square feet of retail space." What is the size of the old Brighton theatre at the corner of Galley & Roncesvalles? Oh, wait a minute, parking. Just street parking.
I guess that the LCBO is so environmentally concerned (like Metrolinx) that to encourage transit use, they would locate their LCBO stores in a parking lot.
Dude, it's a parking lot about 100 metres from a frickin' subway station. Seems pretty convenient to transit to me.
I understand the need for parking (I guess) but that is a really terrible location. It is a dreadful plaza. And for many people, to walk/ride up to Dundas is no closer than going to the existing Brock store. The main strip of Roncey is where everyone shops, but rather than find a location in the middle of the community, they have to go to some dead-zone has-been dust bowl on the outskirts. Disappointing.
yes...but, why can't the "dust bowl" of a plaza be revitalized as well?
It's not that far from roncey's community
A) for all the folks complaining about the distance, if they opened one on your corner you'd probably be complaining that it was too close and that you can never find street parking for your own vehicle.
B)I live at Dundas/Bloor, and my options are a 25-35 min walk to to either Dufferin/Dupont or Runnymede/Bloor. Considering the volume of condos/apartments plus the subway, it makes sense.
C)As far as the plaza being a 'derelict'. Agreed, but do you think the LCBO is just going to set up shop in the old dry cleaner/hair salon space and open their doors for business? I'm sure the building will be refaced and improved as a result of the LCBO moving in there. Hopefully, as a result, that space from Starbucks to Bloor will fill in with some great adds to the nabe.
D)To the comments about being 'driver-centric'. Did you ever think that perhaps people that would never explore the great independent shops on Roncey just may do so now that they know they have a place to leave their car for 30 or 40 min?
Seriously folks, so much complaining. As aome one posted earlier, it's a liquor store for goodness sakes. If you're pissed cause you want to buy your hooch at the corner store, this is not the place to affect that change.
they should just tear up roncesvalles permanently; like, the whole street
It's always about parking in Toronto! What a joke of a town we are.
It's always about parking in most towns...because people who have to transport groceries, and children, the disabled and the elderly can't do it in a bike basket.
I just don't understand why so many people downtown can't understand that.
When you need to move something, you go looking for someone with a vehicle...the rest of the time you hate them.
For the short term, the makeover of Loblaws and the move in of the LCBO might prompt some reworking of that parking lot... It doesn't have proper pedestrian walkways into the place... If you actually follow the pedestrian lines on the ashphalt, you would walk diagnally across the driveway for about 50 metres...
i think i teared up a bit when i heard this news. dreams do come true.
I too had a tear. We in the Westbend are pleased to have it close to our area too. Thanks LCBO
The LCBO phased out plastic bags entirely nearly a year ago. You can get a reusable bag, or paper, but they will NEVER have a $0.05 bag to sell you, ever again, because they simply don't make them anymore.
Um, I'm pretty sure it's going to go into the West end of the mall, where the old dry cleaners & dollar store used to be. I mean, 5600 square feet is a pretty big amount of floorspace, so they may as well use the space that's already there...
Thank you raf! That was a well thought out & eloquently worded response to everyone's whining.
I'm looking forward to having an LCBO within walking distance again (I mean, seriously, if I can walk up to the Price Chopper north of Bloor, I can walk to the plaza (which I do, when I need to hit up Zellers).
Yay for somewhere to buy non-beer-based alcohol!!!
I believe Myself and the other residents of 2252 Dundas st W, win for being the closest to the new lcbo. I am so excited to be able to buy booze even faster than I buy groceries (walk to loblaws...literally under one minute) It will take me 30 seconds to be in the beer section. So excited!!!
Cheers to Raf as well.
I live in the heart of this 'bad neighbourhood' and there is nothing but good ppl going about their business here.
For further insight, I suggest ppl look into the Starbucks R and D team. They dont put one in unless, they are sure the area is, or will be, a financial bonanza (corner of Dundas and Ronces).
Remember that s***hole we used to call Ossington? or Queen West....they seem to be doing, well lets be conservative and say "OK"
This is fantastic! We have long needed a large LCBO with a great selection in the neighbourhood. Good for TTC/pedestrian and car traffic. Good job LCBO!