Resident wants High Park BMX ramps gone

What a freakshow. This Rhodes guy really needs to get a life.

I am sure Mr Rhodes would prefer to have youth causing graffiti and vandalism in his neighbourhood instead, if he wishes to remove all forms of activities and community support from them.

Wow some people are really unbelievable. Does this guy just go around and look for things to complain about? Hmm, maybe these 'punks' should just ask the City if these ramps or even a BMX/skate park could be built there? I wonder what Mr. Rhodes' reaction would be to the site of a BMX/skate park in place of a few hills? If the BMXers haven't caused anyone grief-they're not upsetting anyone, hurting anyone, etc.-then why not just leave it alone, since they're staying out of trouble? I would understand a formal complaint being made if these 'punks' were actually doing damage to the park and harassing park goers.

I'm a 40 year old BMX rider who frequents the jumps at High Park. They are actually safer to ride than concrete bowls and skateparks, because they are forgiving, its dirt! The jumps are maintained by the locals, as it has been this way for decades in High Park. The current jumps are considered beginner to intermediate, and I have personally witnessed countless children master them. The only thing High Park needs is an adjacent concrete park in the field beside the jumps, and city paid employees to keep it going. I'd be happy to contribute.

They have been there I know back in the 80's when I used to ride them. I think they have been changed to a extreme of late. Before it was all natural.

Is this the same guy who says kids these days sit in front of the TV and play video games and need to get out and enjoy the outdoors? Well thats exactly what these kids, teens and adults have done. Dirt Jumps take years to build and constant maintenance, not to mention they provide kids with a healthy way to spend their day as opposed to the TV.

Let the kids play.

Sheryl;

Someone needs to tell you to keep your kids at home because they are destroying the Red Oaks in High Park that are a protected species by law!

Dh;

I doubt if Rohdes house is under any environmental protection laws such as High Park is. The so-called dirt mounds are illegal under city by-law 608-29 sec a-d and unless these youths are park employees, which none of them are, have no legal right to alter the landscape from what it was before 30 years ago.

Durand;

That's where your wrong. The Bikers have been aggressive towards other park goers including rock throwing, trying to run over younger children that are in their way, not to mention the trees that they have destroyed that are protected as well as trilliums that are a protected species. There are many people not in favor of what is going on there and are very offended by the illegal activity and what it to stop.It sounds like you and the rest that have posted here need to learn some respect.

Greg;

It sounds like you are mirroring as the freak here is you! You don't know Adrian and he is far from a freak!

Ian;

Rhodes is not suggesting to have all forms of support and activities from them. As a matter of fact in the article he has offered to help them find a more suitable location for their activities. Dumb d dumb dumb that's you!

hi sdisturber!

The High Park Org's MISSION is to "PRESERVE". Police Unit 11 legally ignores the by-laws of High Park and allows the destruction and mission of High Park.

I hope that someone with some sense will find somewhere else to build your concrete walls and ramps if that is what the good people of Toronto want, esp. the police and Constable.
The answer is simple; just go to the other Parks that already have BMX.

Yet, BMX=Big $$$, and it is clear that the police are turning their heads the other way so that more big $$$ can be brought into the region despite the several BMX parks available.

Finally, if you don't want to be called "punks", stop acting like one. Your responses here show your real attitudes.

As for your "secret" place; it's all over the internet as to who, what, when, and where all of you have been engaged in this ILLEGAL activity.
You are all easily identified so why don't the police enforce and ticket all of you and others under By-law 608-29 Sec. a-d?

Correction to post above should be:
Police Unit 11 ILLEGALLY ignores the by-laws of High Park and allows the destruction and mission of High Park.

Not:
Police Unit 11 legally ignores the by-laws of High Park and allows the destruction and mission of High Park.

Then again, the unit seems to think their inaction is unimportant... But if someone gets hurt or worse... where then will lie the responsibilty and legality?

The final issue is that High Park is a place to be Preserved, not destroyed as the BMX'ers are doing; And the laws are being broken. What does breaking the law with police approval teach our youth????????????

Reply to person posing as Cornelia and not Cornelia.

We can see the little games you are playing at the expense of the environment and other concerns. You have showed yourself to be a punk. It is not more than just a few kids and and a couple of older dudes. As we know who all of you are. Maybe this won't be so funny to you when you begin to get legal notices for the damages you have caused! yes you are all getting sued and that includes you Dave Stewart!

To Cornelia who is not Cornelia.

It is very apparent that you are punk trying to play games at the expense of the other environment and other concerns.
Maybe it won't be so fun or funny for you and others are participating in destroying and environmentally sensitive area. We know that it is more than just few kids and a couple of older dudes involved. We have been watching you and have all of your names, as all of you will be sued for the damages and be served legal notices soon, and that includes you Dave Stewart!

Oh, one more thing if you are calling those mounds in High Park hills you are truly ignorant. If you want to see hills come to the Hatfield and McCoy trail in West Virginia. these are hils, those raised areas in High Park are graves dumbass. Of course the ones that ride down here are true men. when we have disrectful people that go off trail they get fined and told not to come back. You hp boys need to learn what it is to be real men

I think anyone who supports boiling puppies is much more than a freak. I hope Mr. Rhodes looks finds some top notch mental therapy real soon.

To you David Stewart because we know it's you posting on here.
You are the one who is a freak and sideshow on here, as you pretend to be Native. Native people have respect and respect for those you have passed on. You don't! The equation doesn't fit for you to be Native as you claim. I think your just a dumb ass honky you thinks he is something that he is not. And no the area that you have destroyed down there is "NOT YOUR LAND". So get lost and take your freaksideshow somewhere else out of High Park or very soon you will not be permitted in High Park again and you will be sued along with everyone else who is participating in destroying the park for the damages.

Oh Yes David Stewtart if wasn't for your long hair, no one would believe that you are native, because your actions certainly don't show it!!

Cornelia, they hide their shovels on the other side of fence by the south duck pond

Is that the best shot you have Robert B.?? You along with rest of these park destroyer moron geeks really need to find something else to do positive with your time and not destructive. It's quite obvious to many of us that what you have done and continue to do is very destructive on many fronts. And a price will be paid by you and others for your destruction.

The words of a moron is spoken by Robert B. For I am not nor is anyone else who opposes what you are doing a caged tire.

Keep posting your comments, as the more of who do, the more are identified with destroying High Park, and the more will be held legally responsible for the damages in High Park. The only people that are feeling any heat is those that continue to show disrespect to the ancestors and to the natural environment. And when the heat of the ancestors falls upon you it will no longer be amusing.

Many Indigenous People throughout the world know about the destruction you have caused in High Park and do not support you or what you are doing. Yes your days are numbered in High Park!!

Yes ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM right out of High Park with your destruction!!

SDISTURBER: get a life and a job. you obviously have no fun, and have too much time on your hands. the bmx track is one teeny tiny corner of the park that most people never even venture near. quit being a busybody douchebag. tell your friend adrian to get a life as well. maybe you two could go hang out together?

replying to to the moron sidefreakshow Brian who frequents the park with David Stewart and like to spend their time with young boys like MJ. Oh yes by the way I have a life and a job and I am having fun poking at the caged tiger Brian.

Again your misinformation is incredible!! What you call a Bmx track has never received any official permit from the City for being there, and it will never receive any such permit from the City. There are many people who travel through the area, walkers, joggers and illegal biking off the paved pathways. Many people use it as shortcut. And there is a walking trail that goes through the same area, as the illegal bmx track.
You think you can post your ridiculous comments on here in order to get some sort of public sympathy and support so that people who have never been to High Park don't know what is going on there. That is actually backfiring on you. Public opinion is turning very quickly against you. As I said before keep commenting because the more of you douchbag moron sideshow freaks that comment, the more of you will be rounded up and sued for the damages that you have caused.

Aha! I'm pretty sure I saw this troll, SDISTURBER, poking around in the dog poop bins in the off leash area collecting choice specimens to take back to it's newspaper-filled, hamster-piss drenched bachelor apartment. I've got your number SD and it's YOU who'd better watch out, you squirrel molesting creep.

if the bmx track is illegal, so is the walking trail that goes through the same are.

by the way, i live in bc now, where attitudes have stepped into modern times, and dirt jumps are the least of our worries. these letter justify my reasons for leaving that pompous, arragont, and aging population of a province behind. don't worry, all the naysayers will drop dead soon enough.

And to you you ignorant Dumbass moron Ron, there is no by-law outlawing soccer fields, baseball fields and swimming pools.

On the other hand by-law 608 29 sec a-d does outlaw the type of activities going on the south end of park. Therefore take your dirt jumps and shove them up your unroyal BC ass!

No the walking trail is not illegal you shitbox moron excuse for a human being Ron. The illegal jumps are illegal according to by-law 608 29 sec a-d. The jumps days are numbered!

To the dumbass moron Ron who has just opened his asshole and spoken out his asslips.

There are many who have visited the site and are appauled and disgusted at the damage to the environment as well as a cultural site. People are condemning the disrespect for the environment and the Indigenous heritage of the land that has not been respected. Would you like if people transformed the graves your mothers, fathers, grandfathers, and grandmothers into a BMX park??? I highly doubt it.That area does not belong to the BMX community never has and never will, nor will any area in High Park for that matter. So again if you want a BMX park, which there are 2 very close by already, then either use those areas or take your illegal activities out of High Park, because there is a time coming very soon that your illegal activities will be stopped legally and all of you will be held financially responsible for the damages. No fighting on your part will get you anywhere in High Park but out of the park altogether!

There are no ball diamonds on any Indigenous sites in High Park.
Any of the other permanent trails etc. have been planned by parks employees and the natural environment taken into consideration. There was no planning involved, no EA done before hand, no archaeological study done beforehand. The Area that you have iillegally claimed as a BMX Park is in violation of the PLanning Act, the Environmental Act and the Heritage Act.
The stand of Red Oaks, that are a protected species within High Park, have been destroyed due to the constant altering of the landscape. Trilliums, a protected plant species within Ontario, as it is the flower of Ontario, have been destroyed. Not to mention the constant erosion of soil into a storm water pond. And on top of that cultural damage to an Indigenous site. All of the activities that are going on in that area of park are against the High Park management Plan as well as Toronto City By-laws. Maybe you would not be offended at people turning the graves of your ancestors into a BMX park but many of us are! I don't think I am required to explain anything else to dumbass morons such as yourself who need to learn a few things about respect and respecting other peoples cultures. The jumps will be gone soon never to return!

so why are some activities in that area legal and others illegal. if one is banned, they should all be banned, wouldn't you agree? Or are only certain parts "sacred ground". What if the bmxer's took steps to limit the environmental effects, such as digging drainage channels or bridging those that are already there and planting natural and local plants to help reduce erosion. All this could be done using volunteer and manpower, unlike the soccer and baseball fields which will forever require paid labour and fossil fuels to maintian, not to mention water to maintian the appearence and condition of the playing fields.

sdisturber, there is a big difference between a bike trail and dirt jumps. bike trails are used for excercise, transportation, and sightseeing. Dirt jumps are used by those wishing to progress a sport, challenge themselves, and pursue the best part of being human, which is being alive and free and having fun, and enjoying doing something for no other reason than because you love to do it.

"Dirt jumps are used by those wishing to progress a sport, challenge themselves, and pursue the best part of being human, which is being alive and free and having fun, and enjoying doing something for no other reason than because you love to do it." The quote of an asshole Ron who speaks out his asslips.

Again you dumbass airheaded moron, you can do all that elsewhere not in High Park anywhere off of the paved pathways.

quote from the airheaded asshole moron Ron:

"Dirt jumps are used by those wishing to progress a sport, challenge themselves, and pursue the best part of being human, which is being alive and free and having fun, and enjoying doing something for no other reason than because you love to do it."

Quote from a descent human being , Cornelia,
" From what I have seen, BMX "culture" is full of "death-metal" themes and isn't just good, clean, fun.
I've seen photos of some of your younger "members" with open beer bottles and cigarettes. Your names and pictures as well as the destruction of High Park is easily found. There are many of us watching you...
You have destroyed the High Park endangered species plants, trees, and more. It isn't too late to restore the area IF the High Park Preservation organization will not bow to a few self-promoting individuals who want to "control" all of you, your graffitti, and more destruction at High Park. There are much "Higher Officials" who will become involved as well."

Get that through your thick airhead, mo "Ron".

Corneilia, if it seems like bmx sites "brag" about their injuries, that is just because, well, they probly do. To take a fall and serious injury, and get back on the horse, or in this case, bike, takes courage and deterimination. injury is a part of this sport, just like anyother sport. as for liability, find some statistics that compare bmx injuries to that of all the other sports in the park, and also add automotive accidents as well, as many people may drive to the park.

i am from ontario sdisturber, i moved to bc to get away from people like you.

you are the pigheaded airhead who is trying to shove your bmx culture donw the throats of people where it is clearly not wanted. Take your BMX SHIT and Shove it asshole!!

sdisturber, you contradict yourself. if the whole area is sacred ground, why is ok for the playing fields to be there and not the jumps. you did say the "that whole area is sacred ground". you have been rude and done nothing to further this discussion, so now i am going to stoop to your level...maybe your "ancestors" shouldn't have traded their land for a box full of liquor.

stay in BC with your disrespectful BC attitude toward Indigenous people , asshole!!

have a good night sdisturber, your screen name is fitting, but cowardly.

and your screen name is fitting Ron = the Airheaded Moron.

Here goes another Moron who speaks what he himself practices.

No I am not a deviant homosexual and have no repressed sexual attraction to young men or little boys as you . It seems as both you and David have a lot of time on your hands to spend with young boys to not have some repressed attraction for them. I on the other hand have a job and a life and have no interest in your sick and twisted BMX lifestyle that shows no respect for anything or anything living.

Maybe the authorities should track you down for the type of threats that you have made " I've got your number SD and it's YOU who'd better watch out, you squirrel molesting creep." Quote from another Airhead moron dumbass Brian Hunt.

"Chris Silva interview" (You guys might want to remove that too since it has all the names from 2007. Chris was age 22 when he had that interview and would have been about age 18 in 2003-2004 when he names "Drifter Dave", (age 30 something) as being "Drunk/high" and a major influence on him. Here's the proof from Chris himself (Sorry, Chris, but you did say the below about "Drifter" Dave.)

("R!" asked Chris Silva):

"R!: I know you have like ten aliases, tell us a couple of your favourites, and
the story behind them. I’m looking for the Klucky and the Sega story.
"Chris: Haha, Klucky and Sega eh?…well Sega came from when we had the ICC warehouse in winter of 2003-04 and it was when I really became good friends with
“Drifter” Dave"...
"he would just sit upstairs of the skatepark
drunk/high and watch me ride calling out tricks for me to do while I was riding, all the while holding a Playstation controller. So it came from there"...

So "Drifter" Dave, an adult, (who encourages breaking the law because he breaks all the laws) "drunk/high", watching the kids play... "Drifter" Dave as an "adult" hanging with children, on drugs.

Again, all of the names, ages, pictures, videos, etc. are easily found (despite Dave Stewart removing his Facebook and others scurrying to delete their data and videos; a bit too late. And we know which "Drifter" Dave/Dave is posting here...)

Now, I'll say something that will shock you.
After watching a ton of BMX and seeing all of you kids perform those amazing stunts, I must say that it does require skill and I'm glad that you are getting exercise. However, we are concerned for your saftey due to serious injuries (which occur even in "authorized" BMX Jams and events where medical staff didn't immediately help a young rider who crashed and convulsed; As found on your own blogs and websites).
What would happen if there were NO medical personnel in High Park and one of you got seriously hurt there? You could die...) WHO will be accountable then, "Dave" & "RobertB"? The police?

There are so many other places to do BMX'ing which you do so well... IN THE RIGHT PLACE. High Park is not the right place, and it is illegal under the By-laws to BMX at High Park.
"There is a BMX Park at Wallace Emerson Park, just south of Dufferin and ..."

Just a few blocks away. Wouldn't you enjoy a little more exercise by riding your bikes to Wallace Emerson Park?

(Where there are more responsible adults and perhaps medical personnel nearby? Why not go there and have some respect for High Park and the Law, even if the "adults/police" want to encourage you to do otherwise. Think for yourselves and watch out for wolves in sheep's clothing. You are being used.

Also, in re: "David" who had "another great early morning session today":

Why do the Toronto Police "look the other way" and allow a drug user to be with children as they "look the other way" and don't enforce the by-laws of High Park? I hope some parents take the time to read this. Are drugs and alcohol "good, clean, fun"? Doesn't it seem strange to any of you here who are not biased or BMX'ers that the police are not ticketing these kids or adults?

The Law IS The Law

Lastly, BMX was NOT in High Park 20-30 years ago; only in the last few years have they destroyed the endangered/protected area that is obvious in the Toronto article picture.
LOOK at the picture of High Park today in the original article linked at top here. The article is still there.
Link to the picture now and see for yourselves. Again, this wanton destruction violates the LAW, and the MISSION of High Park as well as providing "role models" of questionable character who apparently want to teach our kids to "break the law" like they do...

Although their comments are maybe a little too by-the-book, they're hardly "shooting with blanks".
For instance, you've failed to refute a single one of Cornelia's points, especially the ones about nearby alternate venues and legality of BMX'ing in High Park, and environmental damage.

My retort was not to refute or confirm any of Cornelia's claims about damage to the park. My comment was to chide Cornelia and sdisturber for adding red herrings into the discussion about fair use of the park; such as sdisturber's accusations that all BMXer's were into death metal, which is really of no relevance to the topic. Clouding a debate with unrelated claims, statements, and accusations does nothing to garner a consensus. I think you missed the point of my comment. I am not an expert in environmental matters and know not whether the actions of the BMXer's is doing irreparable damage to the park.

My problem with people like Cornelia and their ilk is their blind adherence to the letter of the law just because they don't understand or appreciate BMX. It's a public park and last time I checked this wasn't North Korea.

Just because a bylaw is in place doesn't make it right or just or applicable in all instances. Why do you think the cops turn a blind eye? Because no one is getting hurt (or if they are, they're not crying to the city about it--imagine that: taking responsibility for your OWN actions!) and the park and general users aren't being disturbed.

The area that we're talking about here is a tiny fraction. Much more natural displacement has occurred to make roadways, paths, tennis courts, dog parks...all of which are somehow acceptable to Cornelia and her pal sdisturbed.

The kind of inflexible police state that people like that yearn for isn't the city I want to live in, and policing such things isn't how I want my tax dollars spent.

Cru, I was very glad to read your post and I do understand what you are saying and feeling. The video link is very telling about the freedom and skills that you riders do have.
I do think that there should be a legitimate sport category for what you do. I have watched 100's of trail jump videos (even though the sport is dangerous even with helmets & gear; someone posted that someone died at that jump you posted; I don't want to see that happen to young people...) BUT, I do admire the SPORT. I understand why the jumps have been built in High Park, but they just can't stay there, Cru.
I get it though... I really do. At first, in all honesty, I was not impressed with alot of the music and themes and activity in some videos I viewed and some web places/blogs.
But, as I watched and learned more, I really have come to a deep respect for the sport of BMX and most of you who engage in this sport.
Now, the City of Toronto has a plan called "BMX Go Forward Strategy. The document is found here:
http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2009/cd/bgrd/backgroundfile-23825.pdf

I hope that you can come to some sort of agreement with the City (especially the ski slopes areas that aren't used in the summer as a possible place for permanent dirt jumps?)
as to a place for all of you to build the dirt jumps in a good way. I'm sure that part of the fun is the secretiveness of the sport, and also the danger to some... But, I do think that the BMX community deserves a rightful place in Toronto and elsewhere.
The biggest problem is that there has been division about what is and what is not there in the area of High Park that you have the ramps/dirt jumps in.
The High Park Committee has been concerned for several years about the degradation of the enviromental aspect of High Park. They have a mission or love of what they do as well. They wish to preserve and restore environmentally endangered plants and trees. This has been the legacy of High Park since it was gifted to the city of Toronto by the Howard family many years agao. Just like you, there is a desire to do what has always been done in High Park, but the agendas are different. High Park is a beautiful place and there isn't much left in this world that is as beautiful as High Park.
Secondly, there has been evidence of a burial ground there since 1887 and substantiated by a man named ORR in 1921 when Mrs. Howard found some very old bones, a copper piece, and a few other artifacts. More recently, ORR's "Red Paint Burial" articles from 1921, which descibe the area in which you guys have the jumps, have realized into the fact that there is a burial mound there. Not in the picnic area, but in the ridges themselves as well as the exact location the jumps are in. Archaelogists have written about ORR's findings but they say that the bones and objects of at least 7-10 skeletons were not placed with the Ontario Museum at the time. Yet, there are records and a book by ORR about what was found. Recently, several First Nation's People have found much more evidence of a real "Burial Mound" in terms of archaeology, that is: objects, bone fragments, and more in the area you guys have dug up. If plowing over has occurred in the area for the jumps then even more has been disturbed and there may also be more rising to the surface as well. Red Ochre, "Wave Obsidian (a trade item), sand and strata of the area further prove that it is a mound. Attempts have been made to have an unbiased archaeological review an an uninvasive scan of the area as well as surrounding areas. But, there are many restrictions in Canada and licensing is a problem, as well as expense, an lack of cooperation by certain parties... Just like your dilemma in a way.
Some will tell you that there is nothing there, but that would be like me telling you that you don't feel more free without a helmet....
Ok, bad example... I'm tired and it's late.
I don't want to take away your freedom or your rights to enjoy the sport you love, but I'm sure that you understand that the same applies to those of us who fight for environmental protection and to preserve what is "Sacred"... Just like that free feeling, that almost "Holy"? feeling that you get, that the music elicits in the video, and I can truly understand that... Can you understand my POV too?
What can I do to help you get another place that is private and secure as well as free to use, that would be comparable to High Park? A place that legitimizes your sport, and doesn't just keep you all off the street, but is a real place of your own... I will support you in your endeavors and write letters, make phone calls, create a petition, and anything else that I can to get some help for your group of athletes.
Is that reasonable? Would the City of Toronto and Crimestoppers, i.c.c and evryone work toward that goal for you? Could we all come together in some way to make it happen?
Even those who are there confronting you all and insisting that the by-laws be enforced would help you. I know that they would. For ours is not a way of confrontation unless The Great Peace is disturbed; in this case, it is, because The Ancestors have a great meaning to First Nation People, just as BMX means so much to you.
Ours is a way of mending the hoop and making Peace as we have been taught. I want that Peace with you and for you.
I want you to be free too. The Planning Commitee for the City of Toronto needs to come up with a real plan for all involved. Let's try to start with the BMX Moving Forward .pdf and see what can be done. If we work together we can accomplish what is needed for All...
Goodnight and Peace.

Well, now...
It seems that somehow David was able to erase his inflammatory post, but I still had it.
David had posted : "Had another great early morning session today.
LONG LIVE HIGH PARK RAMPS!!!!"

I had written the below in my post:

"Also, in re: "David" who had "another great early morning session today""

(ALL POSTS from Aug 24- the above are missing here. Including calling me "Cornholio" the beavis/butthead male character.)

No problem.

I guess this means there is no "Peace"...?
Waiting for a response.
Cru, I can write to you privately.

I wish you would speak in plain language. You are so cornfusing to us all...
Waiting for an answer from the Crew...

New post at original article link:

High Park: Indigenous Burial Ground

I worked for several years with the fella who has been quietly for about 10 years on this issue. Last year I found an arrow / spear point at the Bike Park, aka Serpent Mound, near the duck pond. It is thought that there are about 30 mounds throughout the park. These type of mounds were last used about 1000 years ago; there is another Iroquoian burial mound that is out along Lawrence West near Bellamy (?). It's called Taber Hill. This type of burial practice was common amongst the Iroquois during that time. This Eastern part of N America (aka Turtle Island) is full of the ancient burial mounds of our ancestors. It was common partly because we had the land (earth) that was able to be mounded up - the people of more northern climes were not able to bury in this way because of the rock of the Canadian Sheild.

FYI

I know...

I need to make a few corrections for the High Park Burial Mounds data:
"First reported by Orr (1922:38-40), this site was discovered in January, 1921, during road construction on the property of Mrs. J. A. Harvey..." (Not "Howard", as previously reported here.)

In fairness, thought we should post Chris Silva interview at 2007 i.c.c. "Warehouse"
http://www.bmxunion.com/blog/interview/chris-silva-interview/

Why is "BMX UNION" so lame? (no offense)

Interestingly, Chris Silva, says," He goes by so may aliases, ... he is a man to be stopped."

But, maybe you all don't like Chris Silva?

Thank You, Mike W....

Where to begin.

No one implied that Rhodes called anyone a punk. The punks bit was outside of quotation marks which means that it was NOT a quote. That's how the English language works. Fun fact.

Since an environmental assessment has yet to take place there is no conclusive evidence that any trees have been destroyed.

The evidence for the burial grounds is also not conclusive. From what I've read, there is speculation that there is a burial mound at Hawk Hill. Hawk Hill is in the centre of the park.

I would also like to see your statistics on BMX deaths and injuries in High Park, Cornelia. Surely you understand how evidence works.

you people make me laugh! Cornelia and sdisturbed are obviously judgemental douchebags who don't know me from adam, yet seem to have me all figured out. For the record I will continue to do what I fuckin feel like doing, and those who oppose my soul flow, already know they can polish my huge dick (after theyre moms are done of course)
keep on keepin on bitches!

ps....am I pissing you off yet????

im willing to bet the ppl who care for these trails and keep them clean of garbage and glass have not damaged any plants or trees in the process, they dont dig up trees there is a lot of dirt to play in. im betting its sdisturber and his boyfriends that put glass around out there to pop the tires of the ppl riding the trails..who is endangering who??
cornelia..shut up you prolly dont even go for walks, let alone go bike rides!
whiners

like!!! lol

Ron had said:
"Corneilia, if it seems like bmx sites "brag" about their injuries, that is just because,
well, they probly do. To take a fall and serious injury, and get back on the horse, or in
this case, bike, takes courage and deterimination. injury is a part of this sport, just
like anyother sport. as for liability, find some statistics that compare bmx injuries to
that of all the other sports in the park, and also add automotive accidents as well, as
many people may drive to the park."


Eric26:

Statistics? You all know how secretive you keep your injuries!
There isn't even an EA to collect data (outside what photos and witnesses have collected!)
If the police and adults are watching the children, let them provide the "statistics"...

But we have blogs from the kids themselves which discuss/reveal injuries.

Throw in the lack of police accountibility and secretiveness and I doubt even you have "statistics" for anything that goes wrong in High Park, including parking tickets, etc.,
unless it made "the news"! Appears that the police aren't even there much if at all?

(Unit 11 where are you????)
However, this isn't a joke...It's a serious issue: a LEGAL issue.

Compare the many injuries on the first one page of a simple search, and one could say that since there is a smaller number of youth (and adults) breaking the by-laws at
High Park by building & using dirt ramps, that the "Probability" of injuries at High Park is likely comparable to the national average if not HIGHER?

Oh yes, Eric26, we DO understand EVIDENCE; "MOUNDS" of it in hand!

Ron had also said:
"Corneilia, if it seems like bmx sites "brag" about their injuries, that is just because,

well, they probly do. To take a fall and serious injury, and get back on the horse, or in this case, bike, takes courage and deterimination. injury is a part of this sport, just
like anyother sport."

O/T?
Ron also had said:
"maybe your "ancestors" shouldn't have traded their land for a box full of liquor."

Ron, Are you saying that you RECOGNIZE the Indigenous Burial Mounds at High Park?
(And where is YOUR proof that a trade of liquor for land was made for High Park???)
Where's your proof that the First Nation People don't still claim the land there?

( ; to LilRed whose rant shows that their isn't any reasonable dialogue to be had "like an adult" with) I still hope the serious, more mature BMX'ers are reading the .pdf file I had linked to get the City to HELP them find a place of their own...)


My next post will speak to the issue of the laws being broken at High Park and the PROOF that is available on the issues at hand, which is the MAJOR ISSUE: liabilities and injuries are important, but that is a "part" of the Major Legal Issue:
Laws & By-Laws are being broken without Police Enforcement, the Environmental assessment laws have not been done, and the "Planning Act" laws are being/have been violated/broken.

Where is your evidence that the laws haven't been broken?

I'll elaborate to ALL here in my next post.

Ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law, but did you know:

"High Park is a good example of a unique ecosystem that would be lost if...":


The City of Toronto Ravine and Natural Feature Protection By-law provides for better management of public and private natural areas within the City.

In the areas protected by the by-law you may not, without a permit:

injury or destroy any tree;
change the natural land topography, by excavation or adding soil or other materials on slopes;
dump or place any type of debris including garden waste, leaves and branches;
construct new or replacement structures or retaining walls.
http://www.toronto.ca/trees/ravines.htm

Looks like the BMX'ers are facing MILLIONS of dollars in fines, esp. the adults.

Better read this too:

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/municode/1184_658.pdf

Too many Laws & By-laws to post here on just this issue alone...

So IF you have a permit, we'd love to see who signed the permit!

Looks like "sd" was right... lawsuits coming your way, and possibly the City of Toronto and Toronto Police being investigated for Corruption?

mission accomplished

Make sure you all keep the "OPEN" OUT of High Park! Laws, By-laws...
BTW, shouldn't this event be FREE for the kids?
The City can afford to pay $1 billion a year for police services, can't they afford to provide FREE events in safe area for the kids?

"drifter" said September 3, 2010 at 9:54 PM:
"mission accomplished" in response to me. Does that mean that the City of Toronto is going to find a safe and permanent place to build the dirt jumps outside of High Park?
(Since my "mission" is to stop the law breaking in High Park, but also I had offered to help the kids with finding another place of their own)...
Or was "mission accomplished" another entirely different meaning; My mission, drifter's mission, City's mission, a threat, etc...?

(All quotes and weblinks Posted Under Fair Use Act)

So, you're at High Park; you're in favour of BMX; you're setting an example for the kids; you can't spell Einstien; you seem hositle and threatening generally.

Why should we support your desire for bmx parks as in Toronto's BMX Go Forward strategy? I think, if you are the same one, you said you were at the place one night - when the park was closed - to dig.

Again, are you encouraging anti-social behaviour, or do you not care about the kids? Which is it? Can't be both.

Looks like some recent comments are gone again?
Won't repost the comment as it is found all over the internet anyway.

As per "drifter" on 9/9/2010 :"demonized LOL"

You're "cryptic" or just "plain" words mean nothing to us.
You must have learned how not to communicate from another on here whom we also cannot understand...

Hope the Toronto Police do their job this weekend and arrest you and the "Crew" instead of warn you all again. (as per video that "was" linked here.)

Phil White Arena event was last weekend, so we know where some of you were... what about this weekend, drifter?

Did the police ever catch this BMX'er Child Predator???
Police Warn Of Potential Sex Predator
Thursday May 8, 2008
CityNews.ca Staff
Families are being warned about a potential sex offender who police say is responsible for a series of brazen and disturbing attempts to lure children.

The suspect followed young boys on his BMX bike, in some cases to their homes and schools, police said, and judging by his actions and the way he spoke to some of the boys, he had been watching their actions for some time.

The incidents all happened in the east end. In the first, police say the man approached two boys, ages 10 and 11, who were riding their bikes in the Leslie and Gerrard area Tuesday around 3:30pm.

The man approached the kids and offered them money if they'd follow him to a secluded area. The startled youngsters took off together, riding to the home of one of the boys.

Police say the suspect followed them and then, when one of the boys left the house at 5pm to ride home, he was once again trailed by the man.

The suspect followed the 10-year-old again the next morning as he was walked from his home to school. Police were called once the youngster arrived but the man took off.

The same day, another 10-year-old boy walking along Bowmore Road in the Woodbine and Kingston Road area was approached by the same suspect around 4:30pm, police said.

Judging by the way the suspect spoke with the boy, detectives believe he'd been watching the youngster's movements for some time. The man offered the boy money and then followed him to Gerrard Street East before he rode off towards Bowmore Road School.

The man then approached two 12-year-old boys in the schoolyard, again, offering them money for inappropriate behaviour. The suspect followed the kids to a community centre at their school but took off once they got inside.

Police say the man rode around the school watching the boys inside until a community centre employee confronted him, prompting him to ride off.

The man is described as:

White
40 to 60-years-old
Thin build, about 5'8"
Slight facial hair
He was wearing a black hoodie with a football player print on the front. He had the hood pulled over his head and was also wearing a black baseball cap with a red stripe on the front peak, sunglasses with yellow/orange arms, black pants, dark shoes and red BMX gloves
The suspect was riding a silver BMX bike with light blue tires. The bike has stunt pegs on the front wheel and a sticker on the frame.

If you know who this man is or have had contact with him, call detectives at 55 Division at (416) 808-5500 or Crime Stoppers at (416) 222-TIPS.
(cached at whosyourneighbor.ca) Many other predators and pics of offenders in Toronto area on page. Take a look to be safe!)

Sound like anyone you know 'drifter'????

Any of you kids reading this blogto should check out the the Warning and see if the description fits anyone you know in the BMX world... This guy used "jump pegs" in his tires... WHO had a bike fitting the description? The colors of course were likely changed...

Be safe, kids...

Well, "Biker" who wrote on Sept. 12, 2010 @ 11:37 PM

"Shit going to the jump park today getting all excided to hit some new jumps and when I arrive there its all fenced up and a bunch of natives running around claiming this land was traded for a blanket and a gun and wound;t let anyone ride the park. hope this joke stops soon and let us continue to ride"

"This" is NOT a "joke". The LAWS are being enforced in that High Park area... No Biking.

piss off cornelia, dont you have better things to do then hate on a bunch of teenagers?

This is clearly a joke, no ones destroying the natures or anything the park has been there for over 30 years and therefore it has adapted to its environment. Leave the park alone and take those fences away let the bikers hit their jumps again!

Bleh wrote:
"Cornelia:

How isn't this a joke? how are we "destroying the environment". All we are doing is going there, riding jumps and having FUN, something you clearly lacked in your childhood... How would it be different if we stopped then it would be if we continued to ride there? the jumps would still be there, it would just be an abandonned space. The jumps have been there for 30+ years, and have become A PART of the environment, PART of the ecosystem. WE ARE NOT DAMAGING THE ENVIRONMENT! The city would be better off patrolling the High Park for littering than "shutting down" the jumps.

Around 1.5 years ago, the jumps got all screwed up, the city tried to shut it down, they even cut down TREEES! Yes, 80+ year old trees(yeah, PLURAL), CUT DOWN blocking the paths, and you're telling us, that us bikers are damaging the environment? HA!

Grow up and find something better to do than sitting in frnot of your computer screen picking on us."

My reply to ALL:

Somehow all the "I've been riding there a year" and the "1.5 years ago" don't add up with the "30 years" that you say the jumps have been there in High Park.

Biker said he was riding there "20 years"... (That makes you an adult like Dave Stewart, "The granpappy"...)

Mark, age 13, said he was riding there "the better part of the last year"

There are photos to the contrary of the area and how long you all have "been there" illegally altering a RAVINE and an endangered species area.

About 2 years at most is the amount of time that there has been serious destruction of the area.

If trees were cut down by the city it was BECAUSE you BMX'ers KILLED them by digging/building jumps.

It has not been "30 years".
BMX just became "popular" about 30 years ago. Even "Crother's Woods" destruction wasn't done until "about 15 years ago" (Duncan's City Ride)

(Some telling pics on that site of the major destruction done for dirt ramps)

As for trash, there are beer bottles and all kinds of trash left by BMX'ers in the High Park area... now fenced off.

An environmental assessment (EA) is supposed to be done "sooner rather than later" (Toronto Police/video interview)

But, the Ravine Laws won't change, neither will the Laws & By-laws.

Stay out of High Park or face arrests & fines. It is now fenced off and posted!

Here's the real story on BMX'ing in Toronto by Dave Stewart himself on resessiontour June

2009:

"Street jams have been going down in Toronto since the 1990's. They originally started

with a small group of 10-15 flatland/street riders who would meet at the banking district

and ride the downtown core areas.

In 1998, Dennis Seldon hosted the first real street jam in Toronto. I remember meeting up

downtown at Hogtown with about 20 other riders, and hitting some spots downtown. All

levels of riders were present, from X-games competitor Paul Buchannan to Scotty2Hotty

sketchy street assassin. Many good times were had in this motley crue of anarchy as

handrails, banks, ledges and staircases felt the wrath of the street riders. This

slightly organized jam format was the seed that planted the field of dreams for future

BMX jams in Toronto. Dennis later moved away to Vancouver and the street jams died out.

In 2003, Taro Saito and myself decided to resurrect the street jam, so we set a date and

made a poster to hang up in Hogtown. About 20 riders showed up, Chris Silva being the

standout rider, and since I heard he only rode park, I busted his balls and he proved to

us all he could kill street as well! This jam was the first hint of what was to come.

Later that fall, the Inner City Circle (ICC) was formed in a shady bar above St. Clair

west. I called all the riders I knew and we all pitched in time, money and effort to make

a private, temporary indoor park: the ICC Warehouse. Four months of pure mayhem and

unbelievable good times were had, and many people became tight with the scene. After the

dismantling of the warehouse, the group stayed in contact and often met up to film for

the first ICC video "Lock 'n' Load." Because of that warehouse, a wide variety of riders

would always be down for a session or two.

This is the point in which Toronto street jams became affiliated with the ICC. We

promoted our street jam at Hogtown and all over Toronto by gluing flyers all over the

city. The turn out was better, about 50 riders followed us to some of the best spots in

the city and proceeded to shred. The atmosphere was amazing, riders were going off and

taking chances, fully feeding off the energy created by one another. The next two street

jams were the first advertised via the internet, and the response was phenomenal! Over

100 riders showed up from all over the country to ride the spots and professional filmers

and photographers showed up to document the day. The diversity of the group, combined

with the increasing skill levels of the riders, made for some unbelievable

accomplishments as everyone pushed themselves to "show 'em whatcha got." The result was

amazing tricks going down on amazing spots! The positive vibes made the jams fun for all,

as well as providing an example to other crews on how to create and maintain a scene for

themselves and others. The street jams have become the highlight of the year for the

Toronto scene, because unlike the Bike Show in March, people can actually ride outside

and see this great city and have a taste of the unreal spots Toronto has to offer.

As a result of these successes, the popularity of our street jam has grown through the

internet and word of mouth. This year is the first to officially include some big name

support including Animal, MacNeil and Ten Pack who are all involved in the 2009 Street

Jam. We anticipate a turnout exceeding 150 riders from all over the continent and can't

wait to host a day of super-fun riding and socializing at some of Toronto's top spots.

Overall, we have all benefited from the jams by perpetuating positive vibes and including

ANYONE who wants to show up. The BMX community is stronger than ever and the ICC is

committed to maintaining the scene for all riders to enjoy. We look forward to a future

of even better jams with the involvement of our friends and sponsorship support. Thank

you all for your support and involvement in our projects."

- "Drifter" Dave Stewart, ICC Grandpappy
Posted by Harley at 3:39 PM

So much for "30 years" of digging up High Park illegally.

Further, Kevin Bowsher stated in the Toronto article linked at top here:

"Kevin Bowser, manager of parks and recreation Etobicoke York District, said his department is assessing the environmental damage in the area.

"It's my understanding they've been there 20 to 30 years. This is not a new issue," said Bowser.

However he pointed out there is a bylaw that forbids bikes in certain areas of the park. He has met with staff on site as well as police and is in the midst of assessing what's happened over the past two-plus decades."

Cornelia says:
Based on Bowser's "understanding"... that isn't "evidence".
Pictures of "before" and "after" of the area in High Park today are evidence.

So, how did you know the ramps were changed there?

bleh wrote to me:
"Ok, if you dont want us there, where do you suggest we go (somewhere CLOSE!). I'm not sure you quite understand how much work and effort it takes to build and maintain the dirt jumps.

Also, I hope you realize that it's not just BMXers that use them, its mountain bikers too.

If you say we've done damage by using the jumps. I'd like to see pictures of what it looked like when the jumps were first built, and now. If you're so sure about that, I'd like for you to show me pictures of the changes, because Im pretty darn sure that we have no affect on endangered animals/living things etc.

I am open to yoursuggestions as to where new dirt jumps could be built though, that's in just as a conveniant location as the current jumps."

Bleh (and BMX'ers),

As stated Wallace Emerson (only 2 blocks away) HAS a dirt strip and dirt jumps as does Bayview Arena.
www.toronto.ca states that more alternatives are being explored. (read the below)

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2009/cd/bgrd/backgroundfile-23825.pdf

You will notice that this Sept. 2009 report addresses all of your concerns as well as others (MTB included).


(BTW, I had seen a "fake" video of a "meeting" with the City Council on BMX'ing in Toronto, so I'm guessing that you all feel as though you are not heard by City Council? But, don't stop. Take your ideas to them and get them to work with you. I'd bet if you all refused to compete in the Jams and big events until something legal was built the City would take notice of you (and so would your sponsors!)

I would suggest that you attend the City Council's next meeting and bring others to that meeting to address your needs and an appropriate place besides High Park. Bring an attorney if necessary!

As for how long it took you to build the ramps in High Park, go to pinkbike forums and see how much was fast the area was re-built in High Park just a few months after they were leveled previously.

The pictures of the changes are in those forums as well as elsewhere on the Internet.
Some individuals have photos of the area before the ramps were built, during, and after as well.
It's all on the Internet, Bleh.

The Toronto Police should have pictures for the Permit they received to level the jumps as well.

Don't think I can give you too many direct links here as someone else who posted links to videos and pics had their post removed here.

Good luck with your endeavor to get support from the CrimeStoppers as well to get a permanent place to ride dirt jumps in the nearby Toronto area.
Is the petition for the skateparks to be open to BMX'ers still active?
I will sign it if so.

I did see that you all enjoyed some cold weather events with TorontoBMX last winter.

Since many of you took your Facebooks and other profiles and comments down at certain blogs, it is hard to contact you directly.

As for the Mountain Bikers, I was under the impression that the two groups are not exactly the same and require different types of tracks, etc.?

Bleh, all of this needs to brought before The Toronto City Council at their next meeting. The Dept. of Forestry will need to be involved as well if you seek a more "natural" environment to build in. Then again, you can always plant trees and plants!

Noone can say that you kids don't work really hard at what you do!

As far as not hurting any "animals" that is probably true. Some "nutcase" did poison dogs in the nearby "off-leash" area... but that is another story. Not you guys...

However, Black Oak Savannah and other trees, and endangered species plants and non-endangered but beautiful plants and the beauty of the natural area has been altered or almost destroyed if not destroyed by illegal BMX activity in High Park in the last few years. (a list of trees and plants is at highpark.org); (Damage done to tree roots, directly and indirectly by illegal activity that caused the police to level the area.)

Thankfully, the caretaker's of High Park and it's volunteers can restore the area; perhaps with all of you helping?

Bleh, sometimes when you help and work WITH others, they will help you in return. Sometimes not, in all honesty... Sometimes it's too much "every man for himself" or "get what you can for self", even when one is a giving person...
I cannot assure you of the "outcome" of finding a new place or that BMX'ing on dirt jumps will receive the recognition it deserves as a legitimate sport like it is in Beijing... But, I promised that I would help all of you and I will.

If I had the power to make these decisions you would all start building a new and wonderful place tomorrow!

I do not think that all of you are "bad" and I think I made that clear in my reply to "Cru Jones" here. I only resumed the "mode" of "legality" when no one responded to my offer of help, but attacked me. I am not really a "legalist" or a "conformist" for that matter! I just know how to "fight fire with fire" and that is what you will need to do. Point by Point... with the Powers that BE! And I will help you!

I give you "kids" alot of credit for the extreme dedication you have to this extreme sport. It just can't be High Park for the reasons already stated many times.

Since BMX is big $$$ and you do have sponsors, and the support of the Toronto Police, higher authorities, and more, I'm sure that an addition to Bayview & Emerson dirt jumps or a new area will be easily found.

Both are in CLOSE proximity to High Park. Get your parents to attend meetings. Go yourself, if you are "allowed" (I noticed that the Toronto City Council has a lot of "closed" meetings... that needs to be changed too.)

DON'T do anything that will turn the powers that be against you. Like Illegal grafitti or other destructive things. Noone will listen to you if you do that.

Lay out your needs and your "ideas" (with options/bargaining chips) to The City Council with the proper authorities PRESENT. Make sure that everything is done by letter request... (Slow Mail; certified letters)

Study the laws.

Perhaps even your Civics teachers can help you with this.

You do have certain rights. Find out what they are, and carry them to the next level, legally.

Organize. Get everyone in BMX and MTB together at a meeting. (not a bar) Schools are ideal for public meetings such as this because they are open to TAXPAYERS for your use.

Be very clear about what you want.

Go "point by point" like I did here.

You can do it... But, it must be a place without Laws, By-laws, etc. which will stop you in your tracks. (Such as the High Park situation)

Make sure an EA is done first of an area, etc.

Seems the best thing is to look over the "proposed" alterantive areas if for some reason you are unhappy with Emerson and Bayview, (see pg. 6 of .pdf doc and the rest of the doc,) get adults with "BMX expertise" to volunteer to help "Staff" at Bayview for example.

Look at the "Options" on page 7 of this 16 page document.

What can you do to make it happen?

Write to the people named in the document. Make your letters formal and check for spelling errors, etc. ACT like a "business person"... This could even be a school project or incorporated into a Senior Project for example.

My father always told me "you can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar"... Try being more "professional";
You are not dummies!

If you can get someone with good leadership skills, that can "lay out" your "case" for you or do it yourself, that would be helpful too. You need a spokesman; but I suggest that it not be Dave because what he wrote here will tarnish whatever you try to do.

Remember, just like in school, you start with a "TOPIC" (tell them what you want), then you add "DETAILS, DETAILS, DETAILS" (provide more information about what you want and what you are willing to do to get it as well as what you expect as the "petitioner"; NO violence, threats, etc... be professional)
Lastly, you SUMMARIZE: Tell them again what you want, what is needed always remembering the "Who, what, when, where, how, why, (and what for)". Just like an English Composition paper.

Present this "Proposal"/"Brief" to the City Council and Sponsors as well as other parties necessary to correspond with.

Fight with the pen and words for what you want and need.

Back up everything by doing your "homework" or research on existing laws.

Seems like alot, but can be very simple.

Write a letter to be sure to get a seat to be heard at the NEXT City Council meeting. Be respectful, dress well (yeah, ya have to do that sometimes), and all of you should present yourselves in a calm and informed manner.
(Do not shout out, make a "rukus", curse, etc.)

"Fight fire with fire" but do it methodically.

You can have a successful place of your own in a place that is legal and right for all of you. If you need further help I will help you as promised. I'll also read, edit, and give suggestions for your "Proposal/"Brief". I think if you follow these sugestions you will be well on your way to having a new place before too long.

No offense Cornelia, but i think your argument has been heard. Stop wasting your time with your massive rebuttals. I think people get it: you've done your research and no one else has. It's your facts VS a bunch of people who ride bikes over mounds of dirt. So i think people get it: you're mad and want the people to stop riding their little bikes over some piles of dirt because it apparently messed with the eco system and it might have native history on it. You know what, you've succeeded because from what i've read on here, the jumps are no longer ridable and people are getting tickets for riding little bikes over the dirt hills. Pat yourself on the back because you have made a difference and everyone is cheering for your victory over the straight edge metal guy and the bmx kids.

Fair enough Cornelia, you seem to be making some sense, although i dont think its possible to stop people from riding in high park, I do believe people will continue to show up, fix them up and keep on riding them. Although I now understand what your trying to say, and I do respect that you are willing to help, so I apologize for bashing you earlier.

In reply to "not cornelia":

I guess you didn't see my other posts which are intended to help the kids have dirt jumps, but not in High Park.
Maybe YOU can help them organize based on my "homework" that was done...that is, if you are an adult...

As per Straightedge Metal (guy) look it up.

"Straightedge Metal" means that one is "clean & sober", refrains from using alcohol, tobacco, and drugs, as well as other things. (Clearly NOT a "straightedge" guy as per Silva interview)

"Straight Edge people of this early "old school" era often associated with the original punk ideals such as individualism, disdain for work and school, and live-for-the-moment attitudes."

Of course the term has "evolved" into much more, but I guess you must be referring to Dave, whose language here as well as his jumping in High Park with the Toronto Police there screaming, "Is this your grandmother? One more jump on grandma's grave!" shows that he is not a "Straightedge" guy!
He's supposed to be "Cree" as well.

My recent "massive rebuttals" are intended to "Help" the kids here. What are you doing to help?

Finally, the kids knew the activity was illegal but were encouraged by "adults" to continue the digging and building of ramps in High Park.
If the laws are being enforced (and they are), it is not just a result of my posts here in a blog, but rather the efforts of many others as well.
It is the law, "not cornelia"...

Borys Koch wrote:

"Cornelia I am interested in your before and after picture of this jump park. A great place to built a new dirt jump park would be at 40 Wabash avenue at Sorauren avenue (beside Sorauren park), Toronto, Ontario, Canada. Currently this site contains an old linseed oil factory, built in 1915. This factory contains ALOT of graffiti and drug activity. This site has been abandoned and bought by the city for and still nothing has changed since at least the late 1980s. Please email me these photos and or the forum link where i can find them at playgames3@gmail.com"

Borys,
The idea for the location by Sorauren Park (key word "Park"; the same laws & by-laws would apply) likely won't work? unless you can convince the buildwabashnow.org/ to turn what they want to be a community center into a BMX park at the building itself... Worth a try though!

Have you looked at their site? Looks like they need some funding and some help. (Perhaps they would consider BMX if the kids volunteered to help them with work that needs done? I can't speak for them.)

Their "agenda" doesn't "appear" to include BMX or MBX, but does include skate and other sports activities.

They have a good outline for fighting for what they want which could benefit the "kids" here in writing their "proposal". (Follow some of their links such as "Write these Officials", etc.

Looks like they did do some work on the "Field House":
www.soraurenpark.com/fieldhouse.html

Good to see you helping to find a location... The old? Google image of the building is/was? an "eyesore" as well as a likely danger to anyone there in the "Upwardly mobile" neighborhood, IMO. Plz take a look at the links to see new info on the status of the building/area.

"But", as for emailing you, I think we have a "trust" issue here...

For now, we'll need to "keep it here". I won't be emailing anyone or contacting anyone via facebook, etc. just yet (if at all); Esp. if other posters like "not cornelia" and others can't communicate in an adult manner that actually helps the kids find a place of their own...

(As per photos you want (why relevant to a new location that is legal?):

Besides what is on the Internet (which is mostly the destruction of High Park and who did it)
you would need to get pictures from private individuals or in some searches that you can find if you are willing to put in a few hours or days, weeks... and this is an "ongoing" issue with no real resolve yet...

(the kids don't have a legal place to jump yet, and police are enforcing High Park laws/by-laws)

For simplicity, I suggest that you contact highpark.org/ for "before pics" and "after pics" as well as Dept. of Forestry, because they are responsible for "monitoring" the park and HPAC has monitored High Park for years.)

HPAC has .pdf documents on this issue in High Park in a simple search.

I am not at liberty to give you any individual emails, etc. to contact.

Hope this helps.

Resident doesn't know diddly!!!

Cornelia- You seem to be making some sense, so I feel that it is my duty to apologize for being rude to you on Sept 13th.

PS: You should create a real organization (similar to any governing body, you need elected leaders; check to see how your local gov't or school council is structured and get some ideas. It doesn't have to be that formal, but it's a good idea to make yourselves more credible. "Elections" could be as simple as putting everyone's vote in a hat and picking a name. You should also have a purpose or Mission Statement, or a Constitution, and a "quorem" when ideas are voted on. (Decide if 50% + 1 of your members should be present when voting, for example.) Think about what you've learned about governmental structure in school and follow those types of examples for your organization, minus the corruption of course! LOL

Mark stated "

Bikers-instead of just sitting around all day and swearing at Cornelia, why don't we put together a petition and go up to Saundercook's office and demand that the jumps be reopened. Also, let's not vote for that gay-ass biker hater Ford."
Reply

All the petitions in the world will not re-open what was an illegal BMX area in High Park. Any demands on Saundercook or any other politician will get you nowhere in re-opening what should have never have been allowed to go on as long as it as. This is an environmentally sensitive area and has been since 1979. The City of Toronto could very easily impose of the fine of $100,000 on the BMX community for the destruction of an environmentally sensitive area, when no permits were ever issued by the City for a BMX area to be put there in the first place. Not to mention all of the other fines associated with the heritage issues. You and others will continue to be kicked out of that area as the barricades and signs will remain for good.

Suggestion: Find another place outside of High Park to have your fun! Otherwise the police will continue to ticket, fine and arrest you. And the Native people will also continue to work in conjunction with police to make sure you no longer use it for an illegal biking area.

Mark stated,

"That's ridiculous. How on Earth could you fine the BMX community? How would you be able to tell if they're part of the "BMX Community"? That would be VERY illogical and unjust."
Reply

It's not ridiculous or unjust. As people have been collecting real names associated with the BMX community many of which have been sited in High Park, and also know which ones by name who are associated with the illegal ramp building that has caused the environmental and cultural damages. Very easy to pinpoint who is responsible!

So find another place to jump at!

Anyone know who this guy on a red mountain bike was?
toronto.ctv.ca/
Cyclist hit/killed by 2 cars on Sunday, 9/27/10 about 11:09 p.m. at Colbourne Lodge Rd. and Lake Shore Blvd. West... No ID. "age 28"
("may have been trying to cross against a redlight" "deceased at scene" "massive head trauma" "Charges are not expected")

"Police ask those with information to contact them at 416-808-1900, Crime Stoppers anonymously at 416-222-TIPS (8477), online at www.222tips.com. The can also text TOR and amessage to CRIMES (274637)."

Apparently police are trying to identify the man?

Mark stated:" Excuse me? Are you telling me to stay out of High Park? You gotta be SHITTING me! I'll go into High Park if I want, and you can't stop me!"

What Cornellia was telling you for your own good is don't try to go bmxing in High Park off of the paved pathways, otherwise the police will ticket,fine, and arrest you. So yes stay out of the area that has been barricaded and posted otherwise you will be kicked out! By doing what you want comes with consequences for you to pay!

I agree with Mark if people choose to ride their bike in that jump park then people will continue too. The fences only help the park become a bit more private and provides protecting from less noobs to enter and mess around.

Frank says "

I agree with Mark if people choose to ride their bike in that jump park then people will continue too. The fences only help the park become a bit more private and provides protecting from less noobs to enter and mess around.
Reply
Add a Comment

Again it is not a legal or official jump park and never will be. The fences and signs are there to keep people like yourself. And when you are caught biking around in there you will be ticketed, fined, and arrested by police. Many are watching you.

Mark, I had written:

"Mark, Please stay out of High Park. When the Ministry of the Environment's Investigation and Enforcement Branch gets involved it's very serious!

Ontario Court of Justice in Toronto has already fined others for environmental infractions: $100,000.00 and 24 months to pay!

Call the Ministry of Environment if you don't believe me."

(partial quote specific to the question from a longer reply)

Mark, I had thought that you would understand that I meant:

"Mark, Please stay out of High Park areas in/at the illegal, fenced off, posted "No Access", "No Biking" areas or other illegal areas of High Park with your BMX bike.

Of course you can GO to High Park, just not BMX at the illegal dirt jumps (or off bike paths with a bike).

I apologize for not being more specific.

It seems that you are not taking any of my advice to find another place (esp. Wallace-Emerson, a legal area to build dirt jumps). I simply do not want a 13 year old boy ticketed, fined, or arrested. I just wanted you to know the consequences that will surely happen if you or anyone else rides their BMX bikes at the illegal, fenced off, posted with signage dirt jumps in High Park (or any other illegal dirt jumps in High Park).

Please follow my advice to find another legal place for your BMX dirt jumps outside of High Park. High Park is designated as an environmentally endangered/protected park.

The fact remains that it is now OFFICIALLY ILLEGAL to ride BMX at the dirt jumps in High Park. The laws are being enforced and "The Ministry of Environment's Investigations and Enforcement Branch" could already be involved due to the massive destruction of High Park and the "looking the other way" by officials...

This is a serious issue, Mark (and Frank & others here who are promoting continuance of digging illegal dirt jumps and riding them thru BMX'ing in illegal areas of High Park.)

One more time: Mark and others

You have a right to BE in High Park without riding your BMX bikes in illegal areas, but you can't go to the illegal dirt jumps or any other illegal area anywhere in High Park (Ravine Laws, By-laws & Laws, Signage, "No Access"/fenced off areas, Environmental Laws, Planning Laws, Forestry Laws, and more as previously posted here).

I hope this clears things up for you, Mark, and others who are upset about my post which should have been more specific to "illegal BMX'ing in High Park".

(had attempted to reply earlier but this didn't come thru... I have not been ignoring any of you or your posts)

It is now clear that the city council including Kevin Bowser and Bill Saundercook have made very lame excuses to avoid any meetings with High Park Community Advisory Committee (HPCAC)since early spring!

Take a look:
http://www.highpark.org/

"Fall arrives but the City doesn't"


"A small but dedicated group of community council members and stakeholders met last Wednesday in the hopes of having long-standing questions answered by City officials. Unfortunately, City officials and answers to the council's questions were nowhere to be found. In emails beforehand to the executive, City staff, citing vacations, illness and a change in job responsibilities, were unable to provide anyone to assist the council. Undaunted, the council meeting proceeded without input from the City. Those present learned about the upcoming Harvest festival, new children's programming in the park and the hopeful resolution of a long-term environmental issue in the South part of the park. However many members were left disappointed and disheartened by the City's disregard for a community forum that has been in place since the early 1990s and provides thousand of volunteer hours to the park every year.

This recent meeting was suppose to provide the city's answers to long standing issues relating to governance and mandate within the council, which boiled over last Spring. The council, which has traditionally provided input mostly on environmental matters, has been struggling over the last few years to come to terms with a mandate that includes all aspects of the park. Attempts by the council to balance itself and provide representation to other groups in the park, have sparked retaliation from long-term environmentalist, fearing for a loss of their majority on the council. These groups have pulled out of the council in the last year, ironically citing the very conflict they helped created as the reason for departure. To attempt to resolve these issues, the City embarked on mediation last year, which ended in failure as the mediator abruptly pulled out leaving council members stunned and confused.

These issues came to a head at the last meeting of the council in late Spring. Faced with an almost comical continual postponement of the annual general meeting for over a year, City Manager Kevin Bowser (kbows@toronto.ca) and councillor Bill Saundercook (councillor_saundercook@toronto.ca) met with a large group of concerned council and community members. The group raised these issues plus many others that have plague the council since its inception. Both officials promised answers to the groups questions after the summer hiatus. After further prompting over the summer, by council chair Robin Sorys, many council members arrived at Wednesday's regularly scheduled council meeting hoping for answers to these questions - only to have those hoped dashed by the City's absence.

Will the council still be able to represent the community in regards to High Park? With shrinking budgets and the potential for further cuts looming after the election, can the City and more importantly High Park, turn away volunteers interested in helping High Park? Why are City officials unwilling to provide assistance or advice to the council until after the next election? Answers to these and many more questions can only come from the City. Until that happens the council is left in a state of disrepair that only too sadly matches that of the park itself."

As many here likely know or should know, HPCAC has been repeatedly concerned with the BMX destruction at High Park since at least 2004 (minutes of meetings) with NO RESOLVE or help from City Council it appears! "Disrepair...of the park itself" is likely the HPCAC's continual concerns that have fallen on deaf ears and turned heads related to the High Park destruction, ie: Illegal and destructive BMX dirt jumps.
It is time for an investigation by the Ministry on Environment and the Investigative & Enforcement branch BEFORE the upcoming elections!

Legal as well as ethical standards have been and are being breached in this situation. It is time that those responsible for the destruction of High Park and all of those who "looked the other way" be accountable and prosecuted!

Many have tried to "reason" with some of you here only to be demeaned, cursed at, condescended to (insincere
"apologies"?), as well as actual threats of violence (some posts conveniently removed here, but copied and dated; nothing goes away on the Internet...).

I have tried to lead the BMX youth in a good direction, to help find a new place or build more dirt jumps at close-by existing facilities (Wallace Emerson/Bayview) outside of High Park.

It seems to me that there is no reasoning with the BMX kids and the adults who are likly putting words in their "prolly" mouths...

I've been demeaned by calling me "Cornholio" (a Beavis & Butthead character who runs around saying they need some petroleum for their butt&*#!) and yet I have continued to try to help the BMX kids despite their rude & childish remarks.

I have been very patient and have accepted what now seem to be
insincere "apologies" and have offered "apologies" when clarification or an apology was warranted... All for naught.

If we cannot come to a place of "peace" and have all of you in the BMX community here get out and stay out of High Park on BMX bikes at illegal dirt jumps, then you all deserve exactly what you will get. Fined, arrested, jailed...
Eventually, you will face even more serious charges to the tune of at least $100,000.00 and jail time as well as
permanent criminal records.

If that doesn't happen, then there is only one other thing going on: Adults in power are allowing you to get away with this for now. However, there will be an investigation by the Ministry of Environment and other brances of government... including corruption charges and lawsuits.

It's time to grow up, do things the right way (especially you adults!) and follow the laws at High Park.

You people just won't listen to reason and you continue to agitate and not seek solutions. Your whining (and threats)
are very redundant!

When you desire to reach real solutions drop me a post. Seems like eveyone else here runs, such as the volunteer RobertB and David Stewart aka "Drifter Dave".

I won't run, and I won't stop until the BMX community comes up with an alternate place outside of the Officially ILLEGAL High Park dirt jumps which you brag about there being "more".
Frank, the newcomer, seems to thrive on agitation and encourages Mark, a 13-yr-old boy (he says) to continue to break the law in High Park. Sounds like they are listening to "Mike" who told them to continue to dig there!

I'm not looking forward to seeing all of you charged with criminal acts, but it appears to me that this is the only solution at this time. "Pity"...you'll have "missed out on (your) adolesence" (RobertB in his first post Aug. 14)

Perhaps it is too late for this situation to turn around... or is it?

I'm sorry cornelia, I should have said sdisturber.

You are a biker or no?

Poor BMX kids are getting NIMBY'd

lol.

The heck are you talking about? High park is a burial ground? Snake mounds are bmx ramps?

You're not entitled to the same huh.

If the park is truly environmentally sensitive we should be banning dogs and pedestrians also...

Nico, if you have indeed followed this whole conversation from the beginning, you will notice that Brian's posts were the ones that contained "homosexual" slurs to Sdisturber.
Many of the postas have been removed and a few edited somehow. Especially, the ones who threatened others and another by Dave who bragged about being at the jumps again.
I hope that you copied the original posts so that you can see that it was Sdisturber who was attacked with all the "homo", etc. words. Some were very disgusting and flaming as well as downright threatening. All of the posts from Aug. 23-30 are now gone from here.
The Blue names had "website" links which called sdistuber a childmolester on one of them! If Sdis. has been upset, and used the word "twinks", it is because he was first attacked as being a "homosexual, etc".
I agree that this type of "dialogue" is not appropriate to resolve the matter at hand:
BMX'ing is Illegal in High Park; anywhere.

I was the one who wrote about "Peace", but my suggestions have not been followed in any way. Therefore, "No justice, no peace"...

My last post wasn't allowed to come thru here the same night Roxy and electric posted (9/30/2010 11:50 am and 10/01/2010 @
12:09 am) I will repost my response in the hopes that it comes thru.

electric replied to Nico on 10/1/2010:

"The heck are you talking about? High park is a burial ground? Snake mounds are bmx ramps?

You're not entitled to the same huh.

If the park is truly environmentally sensitive we should be banning dogs and pedestrians also..."

electric, there has been ample proof given here in this blog as well as at links posted and books referenced that High Park indeed is a "Burial Mound" (more than one). "Snake Mound" is the name of this particular Mound located in one of the illegal BMX dirt jump areas.

As per your "banning" dogs & pedestrians, the "environmentally sensitive" areas are considered when "Planning" is/was done. Most people enjoy and respect High Park and stay in the posted areas for biking, walking, and dog activities as well as others.

It is only the BMX illegal destruction of the environmentally protected/endangered areas of High Park that have been discussed here because that is the issue here. The other issues such as pedestrians and dogs are discussed regularly by highpark.org/ (and city council if/ when they attend HPCAC monthly meetings; T.C.C. hasn't attended any meetings since spring!)

Others, such as Forestry, are also involved in "planning" so that the endangered/protected areas are preserved to be enjoyed in a good, non-destructive way by all.

Destroying the "LAST INTACT CREEK" as well as the destruction of a "rare salamander" and many endangered plants & trees is not in the "planning" or mission of High Park. Illegal BMX'ing/dirt jumps are destroying these areas!

You need to find another place and get the BMX dirt jumpers out of High Park.

There is no argument left for you. You can say the police are allowing your illegal activities, but the videos prove otherwise. Eye witnesses say that there have been warnings, then tickets, then jail time will follow. It is only a matter of time before all of you are caught by the police. You won't like what happens next: your tickets, fines, and jail time will become your permanent criminal record.

Take the advice previously given and build better dirt jumps at a legal place such as Wallace-Emerson or another legal location. If you read the posts here everything has already been said (and substantiated) that BMX'ing on the illegal dirt jumps anywhere in High Park is now officially illegal.

Roxy, on 9/30/2010 had some good insight and advice:
"im so sorry but maybe its time to move on."

Why won't the BMX'ers here follow all the good advice given here to get a place of your own outside of High Park? You are wasting precious time fighting here for the illegal dirt jumps and are going to be ticketed, fined and eventually arrested.

This "situation" can and will become much more serious if you don't stop building illegal dirt jumps and riding them in High Park, irregardless of "Snake Mound" being there. However, respect for the Mounds that are there is something all of you have yet to gain. Perhaps you never will.

The laws are clear. NO BMX'ing at any illegal dirt jumps in High Park!

Pt. 1 of my non-posted Oct 01, 2010 reply (likely due to length (you know, my "prolly" mouth that "lil'red" wants me to shut; my posts are lengthy because I'm trying to get information out to you. I'll break this down into reasonable lengths so it gets posted finally. ("Part Two" of the "repost" that didn't come thru is above on Oct. 02, 2010 @ 12:56 PM; I will add the additional parts (3 & 4) if necessary to get this posted here.)

Part One: (was attempted long post from Oct. 1, 2010 @ 1:50 am)

On September 13 one here made the statement, "how are we "destroying the environment"."

Looking at highpark.org/ minutes from their last online minutes of a meeting in May of this year I have found:

"Use of the new construction ramp by BMXers.

That would allow them to access the stream bottom land where there are a number of exotic

species of plants and a rare salamander. This is the last intact creek in the Park."

The LAST intact creek in the park!!!! exotic species of plants!!!! a rare salamander...

These are only a few examples of the destruction of High Park that has been a major concern for HPAC for many years, but which has fallen on deaf ears until recently.

It is a fact that illegal BMX'ing in High Park is destroying the environment there. The area hasn't "adapted" as you say.

Your activities are more likened to "urban sprawl" with great environmental destruction in an illegal and protected/endangered area.

The minutes continue:

"Possible Solution:

The filling in of the ramp with logs and branches as well as a permanent fence at the top

end.

"Use of the new hillside as a ramp into the same area"

"Possible Solutions:
Log barriers on the hillside to prevent riding down the slope and some signage relating to rehabilitation. Perhaps a fence at the bottom of the slope or at the south edge of the construction.
The fence erected across the bottom of the creek at Spring Road was a welcome addition to protect the bottom land."

"New Signage":
"A small committee looked at signage suggested...They were basically the same signage we have already in the Park."
(END)

HPCAC has been waiting on City Council since Spring, with "no shows" by Bowsher & Saudercook and lame excuses. Shame on them. I say vote them OUT!

Despite the lame City Council, concerned residents and "Aboriginal" groups have worked with the police to get signage, (even though defaced and knocked down, the signs have been placed and replaced. The fence was put up and knocked down, then put up again. A "No Access" sign had to be put up because of BMX illegal destruction.

Now, thank you for letting us know, "Jordan", that the police didn't check the area and that there is a GANG illegally BMX'ing in High Park. Officials above the police are to
be notified of Unit 11's lack of attentiveness and enforcement of the well-posted laws and by-laws which includes signage and a gate in High Park. The LAW will be followed.

All of your posts only serve to strengthen a legitimate complaint to the The Ministry of Environment and their Investigation/Enforcement branch. If local police and authorities such as City Council and Constables do not do their job, they will be fired, thrown out of office during elections, and likely sued by the "Aboriginal" community as well as others.

The Police, who are making $100,000 a year, that do not enforce the laws do not make the taxpayers happy or anyone feel protected or served. If the police are truly not doing
their job of stopping illegal BMX'ing in High Park
(Unless you decided to lie and instigate "Jordan")
they don't deserve their jobs. (Especially when most people make about 1/4 of that salary and work very hard.)

Is it no surprise that the homicide rate and other crimes are off the charts in Toronto if 2 officers were "Idling for 20 minutes" near the park ("parking lot") doing nothing is
true? What a waste of fuel, tax dollars and clean air!

Unless... the police were secretly surveilling all of you?
Perhaps under Freedom of Information Act you can get the dispatch records and avl unit info from the police?

Perhaps a big "sting" op will go down one night soon in the High Park illegal BMX area...
If so, there goes your future.
If not, then there is a corrupt Police force in Toronto that needs to be investigated immediately. Thank you for the "evidence". I'm sure this entire blog can be subpoenaed in a court of law for "witness" testimony. None of us are are anonymous to the owner of this blog. She has our emails and our ISP's.
Think about it...

On Oct 2nd, Cornelia wrote:"The term, "NIMBY'd", is not appropriate in this situation as there have already been laws in place by High Park and other Ministries which have already disallowed the illegal BMX dirt jumps in High Park. Only now, after years of HPCAC begging for help with signage, fencing, and enforcement, as well as the facts brought to light here in this blog, are the laws and steps to stop illegal BMX dirt jumps being enforced.
(Also, thanks to the "Native Community" and preservation society.)

When a "project" is "NIMBY'd" (slang for "Not In My Back Yard", among other meanings), the NIMBY is based on a "NEW" proposal in an area. The BMX'ers have stated that they have been illegally riding the dirt jumps in High Park "for years",
(despite existing laws of the environmentally endanger/protected areas in High Park.) Therefore, dirt jumps are not "a new proposal", and likely cannot be considered "NIMBY'd"... As per your addition of "lol" in your post; This is no laughing matter. If you meant to call us "Nimbies" then you should have done your homework or read the facts here before posting.

These are not "poor kids", as evidenced by their photos, expensive bikes and trips elsewhere. (Photos & videos that they themselves have posted!)

Good idea though: BUILD the dirt jumps in one of THEIR Backyards! ("close", "convenient", etc.) Or are they "Nimbies"?

Standing up for High Park & the laws does not a "Nimbie" make".


I would just like to state that many kids who go there are NOT rich; my friend who goes there bought a BMX frame for $20, non-matching forks for $10, and a seat that was literally duct-taped together for $10. He threw it all together to form a bike with no brakes, a street wheel on the back and a dirt wheel on the front, and with no handlebar grips. We aren't so rich after all, are we?

I doubt these kids have backyards. If high-park is really an ancient burial ground I think that area should be closed. If it really is environmentally sensitive and possessing some unique feature, the park should be closed. That ought to solve all your silly bickering about it also.

As per what my arguments are I must say, Cornelia i think you're the person without a good argument... These ramps apparently have been there for over 20 years, i'm sure some NIMBY types have always objected to having a bunch of kids and bmx ramps in their park(note it may be natives park anyway if there are remains)

Why do we need to spend all this money to even more strictly enforce and "re-naturalize" the area Cornelia? I doubt your property taxes alone would cover such an operation, let alone adding the other services. Further, are you so naive as to think some BMX kids will stop riding bmx and disappear after this area is destroyed? What is your solution for them? THIS IS NOT A LAUGHING MATTER... Really though, i just think this is hilarious, people get their feathers ruffled about some dirt mounds because they might not fit the aesthetic of the park - maybe we should cover them with artificial turf! So you take it so seriously, but really who is going to listen to your bellyaching - GET A GRIP. Make a solution, if there are so many BMX people riding out there and it is so popular then there should be enough revenue to support a small BMX facility, ask the city to build one instead of complaining. There are other huge issues in Toronto to get way more upset about and spend our time working on.

Wallace Emerson actually isn't that close. I'd have to ride 6 stops on the Subway and the take a bus, whereas to get to the High Park jumps, it's a 15 minute round-trip on my bike

How many are attending the "Hallowe'en Event"?

"HALLOWE'EN JAM"

"Saturday October 30

Wallace Emerson BMX Park (Dufferin and Dupont)

Best rides! Best tricks! Best costumes!

10:00 am to 6:00 pm

4:00 Amateur comp

6:00 Flatland comp

7:00 Open comp

Scarey!"

torontobmx.ca/

(I haven't seen that posted here nor other events I have found. You all seem to make it appear that you have no place to go besides High Park, which is NOT true.)

Electric Stated "electric / October 3, 2010 at 8:42 PM

Cornelia, please clearly post your argument against those dirt jumps that have been there for over 20 years."


The jumps that are there now have not been there for 20 years. The previous jumps were dismantled and leveled last year, 2009. The current jumps were re-erected beginning in March 2010, as this site has been heavily monitored by many people, to know the who, what, when where, how and why.

So again as Cornelia has suggested you need to read through all of the posts and the suggestions that she has made, and leave the illegal dirt jumps alone, because sooner or later they all be gone, and no more dirt jumps in High Park to be arguing about.

Too bad that it is only 15 minutes ride from some peoples homes, Wallace Emerson is available legally, use it it stop your whining and complaining because all that will not re-open what should have been closed down by the City a long time ago. Now that they have , you need to accept that and move on as Roxy has suggested.

electric / October 3, 2010 at 8:42 PM wrote"

"Cornelia, please clearly post your argument against those dirt jumps that have been there for over 20 years."

Reply:
electric, you are seriously trying my patience, which is exactly what you are intending to do. Once again, please read my previous posts here. My position against the illegal dirt jumps has been laid out concisely and clearly in too many posts to copy & paste here.
I'm not re-writing everything again, electric.
Hint: Look at my posts beginning about Aug. 23, 2010 thru present.

sdisturber, you clearly lack a good understanding of the situation. The jumps have been there for a long time as I understand it, the city can come in and play wack-a-mole, but that is just a waste.

btw who is watching the area? lol cornelia with binoculars.. rofl. busy body. hopefully she doesn't end up in the back of a cruiser herself.

I don't even ride bmx or really visit that park, i just find the whole thing hilarious. It really is too bad about the *possible* burial ground though.

You also mention this bmx park? i wonder why the riders don't go there. too far? too expensive? too many rules? some other groups turf? I think you guys are mostly clueless busy bodies.

Cornelia, what do you mean by not being able to tell weather I have a girlfriend or not? I'm thirteen.

I am the one who was interviewed in the article. First, the area has been known as a track since at least 1988. The area is also an environmentally protected site, area 114 according to MTRCA, 1982. As well, it is an area of natural and scientific interest, according to Geomatics, 1991.

On this site, I have heard threats, seen vandalism, especially of the signs and gates that are there now; I have also had rocks thrown which nearly blinded me. When this happened, I also saw an elder get hit by a rock.

Little kids cannot handle the rides; it is too steep for them. As well, one rider tried to intimidate me by making a big thing about being a 'city worker'. My friends who are city workers laughed their heads off at that: they said he must have been NFG if he wasn't working during the middle of the day in summer.

BOttmo line? It's a protected area, and the BMXrs are willing to use lies, threats, intimidation and violence to enforce their ends. That's not a good message to send to kids.

Or do you disagree?

Yes Adrian, as a matter of fact, I do disagree. I have been riding there for over a year, and many times have I seen non-bikers go through there. We are always very respectful, and if you happen to have had a rock thrown at you, I think that you should go to the police!

Adrian, saying the jumps are to steep is an invalid argument. Those jumps are easily mastered by kids under the age of 12.
I seriously think that sending police to monitor this area is a huge waste of taxpayers money.

Like I say, I didn't witness any of the "negative behavior" that you described, and I state once again, that if a rock was thrown at you, then you should go to the police.

Excuse me sdisturber? That was rude and totally uncalled for, and I expect and apology. If I actually did have Aspergers Syndrome, (which I don't) wouldn't you feel like the biggest asshole in the world?

I've been following this thread since it started around mid-August, and have been totally disgusted and at times infuriated by the sophomoric posts made by sdisturber. I try to avoid flaming, but I think this one is warranted. You sir, are an abusive, insulting, vulgar, illiterate, knuckle dragging, mouth breathing, bone headed moron. I cannot believe you put food in that disgusting mouth of yours. You don't have the intelligence to compose a coherent sentence, your spelling and grammar is atrocious, you are so unoriginal that you abscond quotes from others and twist them to suit yourself, and to top it off, you are so lame brained, insults go over your head. I've come to the realization that you are a troll, who plays on the Internet to get your jollies by flaming others. Do something productive with your life. May I suggest jump off a bridge?

sdisturber, you're behavior is atrocious, you're posts make no sense, and I think that all who are following this conversation would agree that my behavior is much better than yours. And I'm thirteen.

Mark states " sdisturber, you're behavior is atrocious, you're posts make no sense, and I think that all who are following this conversation would agree that my behavior is much better than yours. And I'm thirteen."

Mark your behavior shows clearly that you are a moron the way you have attacked Cornelia, Adrian, and myself, who have tried to present the facts to all of you.

You clearly are suffering from Dippity-Do-Itus. Cock roaches you are.

Thanks Troll for saying I am cool.

I would like to draw everybody's attention to Section 2., subsection (c). of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms: 2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:
(c). Freedom of peaceful assembly.
We bikers were assembling peacefully at the dirt jumps in High Park. I'm just putting it out there.

sdisturber, from what I could make out from your misspelled statement, you said that our intent by assembling in that area was "nothing but to be confrontational". Our intent was to go biking and socialize, not hate on groups or individuals who want the dirt jumps closed.

While there may be no misspelling, your grammar is very hard to understand. If people have had stones thrown at them, then why haven't they gone to the Police?

Mark, I know you are young. Don't let this sdisturber bother you, he'll follow you around like a stale fart if he knows somebody will listen to his ranting.

As for the rest of the perverts in this thread videotaping kids... maybe you should be more careful before Mark phones the cops after he catches you in the bushes with a camera... eh?

Bike jumping season is over. We can all argue over this next season. Tis the season!!

NEW TITLE

BMX'ER WANTS HIGH PARK RESIDENT TO CLEAR SNOW FROM THEIR SIDEWALK AND DRIVEWAY WITHIN 30MINS OF SNOWFALL OR GET OUT!!!

Electric stated, "

Mark, I know you are young. Don't let this sdisturber bother you, he'll follow you around like a stale fart if he knows somebody will listen to his ranting.

As for the rest of the perverts in this thread videotaping kids... maybe you should be more careful before Mark phones the cops after he catches you in the bushes with a camera... eh?"

The biggest pervert Electric speaks. So you are calling the police perverts, as they are the ones hiding in the bushes taking pictures and gathering evidence on all of you.
Can't wait to show the police your newest spew of verbal Diarrhea.

No response to that, sdisturber?

Mark, I had actually spent a long time finding alternatives for you and my post didn't come thru here.

I spent hours on google maps looking for places for you all to find the most convenient way to Emerson Park without the subway or buses, and had a bunch of great biking map links. If this comes thru I will try to post the links again.

Cornelia, I appreciate that you are trying to find an alternative location for us, but regarding the article from Ohio, I think that the version of the story that the newspaper picked up was a version heavily modified through rumors. I also thiink that if the death threat allegations are true, the blame should fall on one idiotic individual, not a whole community of bikers.

The reason that I post comments during the school day is because I come home for lunch. I am in the grade eight extended french class of a certain Mme. Hall at Swansea Public School. And the rumors that I am talking about are the rumors that a death-threat was issued on site. Moreover, why don't you listen to Cornelia, and not insult me by telling me to "get a life"?

No, Mark,

The emails, among others not posted here, are being circulated to many Tribal Nations in the U.S. & First Nation's in Canada. The email is not based on the news article alone. Only a very few parts of the email were posted here. The original news article nor this blog were not attached to the email. The senders forwarded the email to me FROM CANADA, FROM OHIO.

The Ancient Mounds of Ohio are well known, Mark. (Did you know that there is actually a city named "Toronto" in Jefferson Co., Ohio (where many of the Mounds are built, as well as city named Toronto, Kansas?)

There is a connection to all the "Moundbuilder's" Mounds, all the way to Toronto and beyond. (See books on this subject, some online info too)

Yes, the news article and MORE info is in many other Indigenous group newsletters and blogs, but only brought more attention to what was already known about the High Park Mounds.

In summary, The Indigenous People are pulling together others from outside Toronto. They are gaining much more support to protect and maintain the Mounds in High Park, and they are from all over the North American Continent.
(Many non-"Native"/non-"Indigenous" people are helping to stop illegal BMX activity in High Park as well. Some want the laws and by-laws concerning High Park and all parks & ravines, etc. laws enforced because they are environmentalists and wish to preserve & protect High Park; an endangered Park, which I also tried to post more data about here.)

As evidenced by the partial email I had posted, this is no longer just about illegal BMX'ing in High Park.

Illegal BMX activity on Mounds in Toronto is serious, and more legal actions are in the making as I write.

On another note, I did try to post those biking map links for you and a "short argument" reply to electric, but again they did not come thru here. I do not know why.

Will try again to repost free biking maps and web tool map info for you, as well as my "position argument" for why there should not be BMX'ing in High Park.
("Short version")

Lets' all try to keep this on an "intelligent" level without any exchanges of "personal insults" and especially threats which are serious and real. I had also tried to post about the law and what a subpeona is, Mark. Better look it up, OK?

As I see it:

There are TWO goals here now:

1. To stop illegal BMX'ing in High Park (preserve/restore High Park Mounds and the remaining natural areas as well as an EA and an uninvasive archaelogical study by a licensed archaeologist)
2. To find an alternate and legal place as well as more convenient ways to get to existing BMX Parks and to build better jumps there. (Dirt Jumps, not just a track) We really don't want you "on the streets" and without a fun place to go.
Of course, no mattter where these jumps will be, they won't be "convenient" for ALL BMX'ers in the Toronto area.


Hope you get to go to Wallace-Emerson Hallowe'en Event! I know you have a g/f and that is great! Tell her that I send congratulations on her Bat Mitvah! It's great that you care enough about her to miss the event.

I think that the Ice Rinks should also do more for BMX in the winter for all of you. (I have seen that they do!)

Also, the safe indoor places need to be supported for all of you. Remember what I said, Mark. The BMX'ing in Toronto is big business. Get the sponsors and others profiting off of all of you in the BMX community to HELP find alternatives to High Park and maintain them for free!

One last item (but certainly not least!):

A woman, who is Indigenous, who had been at High Park Mounds, WAS INDEED thrown from her bike and injured by a "hit and run" driver who is believed to be one of the BMX community... There have been threats here as well against sdisturber (some posts have been removed, but not all)
And a final "heads up": sdisturber is NOT the person that some here thinks they have "his number" and made threatsto go to that person's house. They would be harming another person who is concerned about the "dog-area" and not involved in this at all...

Well ASS, I guess you want me to be offended...
Like I said, you are ignorant and also insensitive to post links about aspergers syndrome here or anywhere in this way!

Stick to the issue at hand, please.

(Not name-calling since that IS your name; ironic...)

I'll pray for you "Ass Berger"... Yes, I do have a son with "special needs" and a brother with Cerebral Palsy from a birth injury. My 79 yr. old mother has dedicated her life to caring for him. My father died when he was only 54. Yes, I have sought "counseling", had to. How about you, Ass?

All the guy is trying to do is make a flipin point in fact I agree to what Mr,Rhode's is saying. the ramps have to be taken down becouse it is so unsafe for people that may happen to walk threw the place.You guy's can say what ever you want to say it's not going to make a difference at all.

There are many alternantive walking paths through the area "red"

sdisturber, while people may like taking shortcuts, we like biking there. And you say that Electric's "spew of verbal diarrhea" was bad.

sdisturber, how would you know what a night in jail is like? Personal experience I'm guessing?

sdisturber, what you are saying is that I can spend the night in jail just by having an argument on the internet? lol, xD, severe butthurt.

dvc,you make a good point. Next time, just try not to swear so much. That's why people like Rhodes hate us.

I really don't see how saying that a person should be "dragged out by the scruff of their neck and being dropped into a large body of water without a life perserver" is a "terrorist threat". I'd wager a LOT that dvc has never seen Rhodes except in maybe a picture in a local newspaper.

Mark, and dvc,
dvc wrote:
"You wanna know something? Adrian Rhodes is the type of person that needs to be carried out of this city by the scruff of his neck and dropped into a large body of water without a life preserver."

Criminal threatening (or threatening behavior) is the crime of intentionally or knowingly putting another person in fear of imminent bodily injury. "Threat of harm generally involves a perception of injury...physical or mental damage...act or instance of injury, or a material and detriment or loss to a person."[2] "A terroristic threat is a crime generally involving a threat to commit violence communicated with the intent to terrorize another."[3]

So, yes, it is a "Terroristic Threat" that dvc (and others here have made against Mr. Rhodes)

There is also psychological manipulation, intimdation, abuse,
bullying, and harrassment charges that can be filed in such circumstances, as well as laws applying to the Internet.

"Online harrassment and physical threats should be reported to the local police.
Some forms of online bullying are considered criminal acts. For example: under the Criminal Code of Canada, it is a crime to communicate repeatedly with someone if your communication causes them to fear for their own safety or the safety of others."

Here's a link that might be helpful for you, Mark:

http://www.bewebaware.ca/english/cyberbullying.html

Interesting that you should say that. Saying anything remotely threatening on the web can get you in legal hot water. So yes, saying that I should be taken out by the scruff of the neck and tossed into a large body of water implies that you want me to drown. That is a threat. You're missing two points, though: first, I can swim and second, who are you going to get to do that, since you're safe at your keyboard, obviously...

"Talkin' ain't doin'" Zoe Washburn

Adrian, it seems like YOU'RE missing a point. I wasn't the one who said that: dvc did. And you're comment at 2:12 pm didn't make much sense in the way of what I should look up. I read the Town Crier, and that article on the front page about the High Park BMX was the first thing that I read. And to sdisturber, it seems to me that you are the troll, but with a twist: The dumbest troll in the world, seeing as the only insult you know is "airhead".

sdisturber, I agreed with dvc on one point he made, the part about Mr. Rhodes going to speak to Sarah Doucette, but I have to agree with you that the death threat was a stupid, boneheaded, moronic thing to say.

I have to say that this is what I would do was I in your position.

Hm.

dragged by the scruff of my neck...that's a threat.
checking out my facebook page and tattling...that's stalking.

If I'm not mistaken, I have to welcome you back to the world. How was your vacation inside?

I believe you might have been the poster here as drifter who tossed off 'demonized' lol.

Please let us know if you think I'm wrong. And try not to threaten me again. Remember: violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.

"All warfare is based on deception." - Sun Tzu.

Who the hell are you people? You all sound like a bunch of old ladies fighting over the remote control in the TV room of the old age home. If you actually think i was posing a "death threat" or a "terroristic threat" You are all losing your minds! Who the hell do you think I am, the Jolly Green Giant? Listen, this forum is long gone. It's over. Roll credits. Everyone has said what they needed to say including Adrian Rhodes. He will now be remembered as the guy who took all the fun out of High Park. A job that he has so passionately adored. As for shitdisturber and Cornelius they can now yank the extra large pickles they've had tightly rammed up their asses for so long during this hard fought journey.
Now, I hope you didn't find that last comment too threatening. On the pickles, not your asses silly!