MB Toronto
Morning Brew: Police struggle to find shooting suspects, a battle for a new city park, crossing the harbour, Chow is not for mayor, busker with a rich past, and subway art
Police investigating Monday night's mass shooting in Scarborough say they are battling a wall of silence from possible witnesses and local residents who are in shock and afraid of retribution if they speak out. So far investigators have received just a handful of tips and made no arrests. Elsewhere, Rob Ford says he will appeal to Ottawa and Queen's Park for cash to help crackdown on gangs. The mayor has previously voted against development grants for struggling neighbourhoods.
In related news, councillor Giorgio Mammoliti says an 11 pm curfew for kids under 14 is the best way to stop gang crime. Council squished Mammoliti's idea for a 10:30 pm curfew in 2005.
Councillor Kristyn Wong-Tam, Toronto Centre MPP Glen Murray and city staff want a vacant patch of provincial land at Yonge and Wellesley to become a new park and not another condo tower. The group hope that the province, who is selling the land, can see beyond "cold, hard cash" and accept and offer from the city over a developer.
If you're sick of waiting for a ferry to Hanlan's Point or Centre Island you might want to consider taking matters into your own hands. According to OpenFile, any vessel is allowed to cross the harbour, making it perfectly legal to take a dinghy or canoe to the Toronto Islands providing everyone wears a life jacket. To the waterfront!
Olivia Chow is often touted as a possible 2014 mayoral candidate with the chops to unseat Rob Ford. Too bad she's not interested in taking a stab at the big job, yet, according to the Grid.
Some of Toronto's buskers are truly dedicated. This one, originally from Bologna, Italy, gave up a six-figure salary and a Porsche to play guitar on the streets in the city.
Finally, what if subway maps were works of art. How would the TTC compare to other cities? Turns out Toronto has something of a minimalist approach to transit, especially with all the bus routes and streetcar lines excluded. (via Reddit).
IN OTHER NEWS:
- Andrew Wiedeman helps Toronto FC rally over Rapids [CBC]
- Machete attack at Scarborough bus stop leaves teen in serious condition [The Star]
- Messaging and memos: An inside look at the Ford Nation playbook [Globe and Mail]
- Fourth Toronto shooting death in as many days [CTV]
Photo: "ThumbsUp" by Ben Roffelsen in the blogTO Flickr pool.
Discussion
75 Comments
Sort By Oldest First / Newest First
Subscribe
Also, the black community should shoulder the blame of what transpired earlier this week. I know, it's the politically incorrect thing to say, but it must be stated.
There's only so much money, police, measures, etc. that can be taken to help a situation. There does need to be some personal responsibility here. This community needs to look within and figure out how it can improve from within.
The city and police have shown they are more than willing to help, but there needs to be some meaningful actions taken among members of the black community - and it starts by coming forward. If no one wants to come forward with information and take that chance then this will continue, plain and simple.
Lets stop tip-toeing around the actual issue here.
If people are afraid of retaliation why not use crime stoppers? It's anonymous and at least it helps the police somewhat. I hate to say it, but you reap what you sow. If nobody ever goes to the police to speak up about this stuff in their community, then they have to deal with the consequences. One of those consequences is unfortunately getting shot at during a party.
I'd be in favour of giving these punks free specialized fire arms training so they'd be better able to kill each other without hitting innocents.
The main benefit, of course, would be that with proper marksmanship training, these punks would be able to kill each other off with much less collateral damage.
I would not grieve a second if two pistol-brandishing punks blew each other away.
I'm currently in Berlin and their system is nothing short of a baffling ordeal: http://mapa-metro.com/mapas/Berlin/mapa-berlin-web.jpg
This "don't snitch" policy that people legitimately criticize, isn't just some slogan from a hip hop video, or borne solely out of a distrust of police. Its a real thing with real consequences, similar to the code of "omerta" from the Italian mafia. People have a legitimate fear for their lives if they talk or are seen to talk to police. Think about it - if these gangbangers are willing to kill innocent people in front of 200 witnesses, do you think they'd have any worries about killing a "snitch" in private?
I'm not saying that people shouldn't talk - they do. The police can only do so much if people don't come forward. I'm just saying that you shouldn't discount the level of courage it takes to come forward when doing so will legitimately put you and your family in mortal danger.
Code of silence=maintaining the status quo.
I wouldn't call the Berlin map baffling - it's certainly stylized to take advantage of the fact that many stations are served by multiple lines, but the one you linked also shows regional rail going way outside the city, plus streetcar routes (the thin grey lines), so it looks more complex than the actual U-Bahn system itself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Karte_ubahn_berlin.png
If the community doesn't work with the police then how can the police identify the perps when they aren't around when it happens? The only alternative is setting up police stations within the community or having foot patrols at all hours of the day.
He wants all gang members to leave the city.
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/cityhallpolitics/article/1228366--scarborough-shooting-mayor-rob-ford-says-gang-members-should-leave-the-city
Seriously. Our mayor suggested this. A grown adult. I guess we better start shipping them off to Australia like the good 'ol days.
Oh wait, it gets better. He's going to ask for the feds to increase the number of years for related crimes, and he doesn't want to hand out 'free money', by which he means social programs. Instead he's asking for more cops from the province. So instead of going with programs that have been working for the past few years to reduce violence, he's going to go with approaches that have been proven to make things worse. What a man.
Really? The whole community is to blame for the actions of a few? You refer to the "black community" as if it's a unified, cohesive group of people who are responsible for the actions of every black person in the city. When white people commit crimes, should we blame the "white community" too? Most of those on Wall St. responsible for the financial crisis - especially those in high positions - were white. I don't recall anyone upbraiding the "white community" for their responsibility for what happened. It's amazing how people can blame a whole race for the actions of a few (the very definition of racism) without the slightest awareness that they're being racist.
The greatest single correlate of criminality is gender (followed by age). Men are responsible for the overwhelming majority of crimes, especially violent crime. By your logic, we should we restrict immigration only to women. The fewer men we allow into Canada (especially young men), the fewer crimes there will be. Are you okay with that? Of course doing so would penalize thousands of men who haven't committed any crimes, but who cares about their rights as long as it reduces the crime rate, right?
We need to take some of that giant police budget and manpower and switch it from, for example, uselessly watching construction zones to policing more actively within the community.
But then when you point that out, you get accused of being
"PC" or of "calling everyone a racist", because all these folks who are quick to (a) identify that the partygoers were mostly black and (b) put responsibility for their actions on teh black community, are so proud of their "courage" in being "un-PC" by pointing this out, without ever really explaining why the race of the gunmen is relevant (as opposed to say, the high likelhihood that they were gangbangers).
As far as blaming the black community? I'm not sure blame is the right word, but if not using anonymous means to turn in the people who are destroying your community, then well yes, blame is the right word.
Either way, when's the last time you read about a white dude walking into a party shooting people?
Look, I don't care what you think of me Dave. I really don't.
I don't think personal responsibility is a bad thing. If you do, that's fine. At some point 'community leaders' that represent all segments of the black community here in Toronto have to come together and talk and figure out a solution. If suggesting this makes me a racist to you, that's your problem, not mine.
Hmmmmm. NDP much?
That "stop snitchin'" bull needs to end.
The problem people have with blaming something on race is that it doesn't make sense. It ignores real issues and doesn't actually solve anything. Like someone else said, it makes a lot more sense to blame all crime on men then to blame something on race. How many of the bankers in the financial crisis were men? How many shootings were done by men? Why don't male leaders in the male community stand up and put a stop to it? Why don't we make it so it's illegal for men to run a bank or own a gun, since obviously the problem is they were men.
Now if the city would only provide them with after school tennis matches, I'm sure none of this would have happened.
Have you ever stopped to ask yourself why you believe that there is a single, uniform "black community" that speaks on behalf of everyone with a darker pigmentation and is somehow responsible for any criminal behaviour by people of a darker pigmentation, but don't similarly believe that "white people" as a whole are responsible for any crime committed by other white people? Race is not the only means by which human beings identify with one another, nor is it necessarily the primary way in which people identify with one another.
I get that people are frustrated with what's going on, and scared - I am too. I just don't think its useful to start scapegoating an entire race because of this. Its a sad fact, but when people (especially white people of European descent) are scared, they look for scapegoats, and often based on race - its no different than in the US after 9/11, when every single brown-skinned person (whether of middle-eastern descent or not)suddenly because an object of fear, scorn and hatred because of the actions of Bin Laden, or in the Southern US where they are passing laws giving police carte blanche to stop and search Hispanics because they're Hispanic.
Me, I want to blame the gangbangers for this - they're the ones shooting innocent people due to some misguided notion of being a tough guy. I want ANYONE who was there, white or black to talk to police and help them catch these guys. Do I think community leaders and organizations (of any race or ethnicity) in those neighborhoods can help? Hell yes, because they can relate to people in that neighborhood because they live and work there and understand the residents and their concerns - not because they have similar pigmentation.
Are you starting to see what I'm saying here?
Really? Show me one article or commentary that made that link. I've never seen one blame the "white community" for Wall St. excess. Instead, its been rightly blamed on the culture of Wall St in which traders are excessively rewarded for taking outsized risk and suffer no reprecussions for screwing up.
"Either way, when's the last time you read about a white dude walking into a party shooting people?"
How about every single school shooting that's taken place in North America in the last 50 years (except for Virginia Tech, which was committed by an Asian kid). Admittedly, that's not the same as a "party" but its a reasonable analogy. Every time there's a rash of school shootings, I don't see all this talk about the "white community" needing to step up to deal with these kids that think its alright to take a machine gun to their classmates - instead, the focus is on things like bullying, restricting access to gund and so forth, without any specific mention of race.
I'm just saying that the same type of thinking that doesn't fixate primarily on race needs to be used here. Is that so hard to get?
Sorry for all my rambling.
I know you're coming to this from good intentions, as are many people commenting who just want the violence to stop. I just don't understand why there's a need to rush and assign blame or responsibility to people based on race, when we don't similarly do this in other when crimes (violent or otherwise) occur and are committed by people of other races.
I don't know your background so maybe the issue is you can't relate to this side of things because you're not accustomed to being held accountable for the actions of anyone who has a similar pigmentation. Maybe if you were, you'd get why I and others bristle at the notion of the "black community" being responsible for the actions of certain gangbangers in Scarborough.
My point was that it's easy to generalize when the group you're generalizing doesn't include you. When someone makes a generalization that includes you suddenly they're crazy, because you know that you're an individual and being white/black or male doesn't suddenly make you part of this huge group. Blaming the violence on the "black community" doesn't make sense. There are so many more important factors (social and economic being the biggest) that would drive someone to be a gangster than race, and it's those we should be focusing on.
I was assuming you were a guy since this is the internet, sorry if you're not.
Look, I'm all for preventative measures and for community work. People make fun of the 'hug a thug' approach, but I see value in. My point in all of this Simon is very simple - there is a lack of personal responsibility in this city. In this particular community there isn't enough that can be done. At some point people need to be responsible for their actions. Allowing a small minority to do these things must be unacceptable.
You are another person branding me as racist, and I do not care what you think. At some point in this city it became extremely unpopular to be honest and not politically correct. As I mentioned to Chris, if you think I am racist, that's you're problem, not mine.
So, next week, when a black guys kills anoth black guy, let's meet up here and talk about white collar crime and how unfair and biased I have been. If you're not available next weeek, I'm sure the week after the same wthing will happen. We can chat then.
I'm not very PC actually. I've never understood why people say police are doing racial profiling when they stop a bunch of young black men after a crime is committed by a young black man one street over. That's not racial profiling, that's looking for a suspect. Unfortunately a majority of the suspects end up being young black men so the police are almost always going to be looking for suspects fitting that description, if a majority were white women I wouldn't mind being stopped by the police and cooperating.
The government and police of today can pat themselves on the back as much as they want for reducing violent crime. However they know it is only due to the increase and availability of legalized abortions in the 1980s and 1990s.
I would suggest reading this blog would clear up things: racialicious.com
Why don't you focus on the issues here in Toronto. In Toronto, gun crimes are largely a part of the black community. Period.
Thx.
This whole thread has been devoted to explaining to you why that's not the case. I think you either need to re-read every comment starting at the beginning or else enroll in a reading comprehension course.
data are well written. I'm wondering how I could be notified whenever a new post has been made. I have subscribed to your RSS feed which must do the trick! Have a nice day!
martial arts supply