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<title>blogTO Recent Comments: The St. Clair LRT</title>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/feed/recentcomments/?13490</link>
<description>Comments recently made in this post on blogTO</description>
<copyright>Copyright 2009</copyright>
<lastBuildDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 08:27:41 PST</lastBuildDate>
<item>
<title>Krupo</title>
<description><![CDATA[
I hope the "southern" line work in 505/504 land actually gets done according to schedule... [nervous]]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c667786</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c667786</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 01:48:03 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>Tina</title>
<description><![CDATA[
As a semi-regular 512 user, as much as I love the (albeit short) ride between the two St Clair Stations, this planned route pissed off too many people in recent memory for those memories to pass any time soon. And as the tracks are no where near completion, it's a bitter reminder of something many opposed from the start.It doesn't help that the proposed end of the line, Gunn's Loop, is in no man's land. Why the line could not continue to a decent connection is beyond the planners, I guess. As a semi-alternate to the Bloor line on hot, lazy days when you have some time to kill, the street car is a joy, albeit very short-lived and going nowhere.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c666431</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c666431</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Mon, 24 Aug 2009 21:52:01 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>Tom B.</title>
<description><![CDATA[
Steve - thanks for your comment.  I will say that P3s only work where the public client (in this case the City) has done all its homework and planning in advance.  A private consortium won't sign a contract otherwise.  My only comment is that P3s force this work to be done, with certainty.  They are not a panancea, and won't work in many cases (St Clair might be one), but in cases where we need huge complex projects delivered in reasonable time, they shouldn't be ruled out.  Given the massive scope of Transit City, how Metrolinx, Infrastructure Ontario, the City and TTC will address this, remains to be seen - I will be watching with much interest!]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665604</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665604</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Sun, 23 Aug 2009 22:14:42 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>Steve Munro</title>
<description><![CDATA[
Actually the P3 had some problems of their own due to changes in the tunnel design.

If a P3 were working in Toronto on St. Clair, they would still be subject to the same bungling and lack of interagency co-ordination.  The only difference would be that they would get to issue a change order for this and the cost would show up with a real dollar figure for changes to scope of work.

There are too many parties to blame for this mess, but it all boils down to each group having its own agenda, and the City failing to read the riot act to them all.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665577</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665577</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Sun, 23 Aug 2009 21:48:21 PDT</pubDate>
</item>
<item>
<title>Tom B.</title>
<description><![CDATA[
It's interesting to note that the Canada Line in Vancouver, a $2 billion transit line that is about 80% underground, has been built, and is open, in about the same time as this project.  It was done as a "P3" project, where the contractor was responsible for design, construction, operation and maintenance (and the in-service date), but as to whether this was the right solution, I say look at the evidence.  The problems with the St. Clair project stem from the fact that the City and TTC didn't consider all the complexities from the outset, and had no plan to deal with them.  P3s can address these complexities, while keeping the asset available as part of the public system.  Ontario is building all its new hospitals this way; I hope that (provincial funded) transit will be included in this scope.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665561</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665561</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Sun, 23 Aug 2009 21:30:07 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Tom B.</title>
<description><![CDATA[
It's interesting to note that the Canada Line in Vancouver, a $2 billion transit line that is about 80% underground, has been built, and is open, in about the same time as this project.  It was done as a "P3" project, where the contractor was responsible for design, construction, operation and maintenance (and the in-service date), but as to whether this was the right solution, I say look at the evidence.  The problems with the St. Clair project stem from the fact that the City and TTC didn't consider all the complexities from the outset, and had no plan to deal with them.  P3s can address these complexities, while keeping the asset available as part of the public system.  Ontario is building all its new hospitals this way; I hope that (provincial funded) transit will be included in this scope.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665560</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c665560</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Sun, 23 Aug 2009 21:29:42 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>ttcSlacker</title>
<description><![CDATA[
It looks terrible and it's definitely hurting businesses, but once done it'll be a huge improvement. I've been living in the area two months now and the progress over the last month has been very noticeable. Maybe it's finally being taken more seriously.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c622634</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c622634</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:35:39 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>Horonymous</title>
<description><![CDATA[
Subway > Street Car
Street Car = Fail]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c620695</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c620695</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:54:57 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>theMediaman</title>
<description><![CDATA[
I think you're forgetting the delays caused by the some of the same people on St. Clair who are bemoaning the length of time it has taken to build the LRT. TTC couldn't even start work on some sections simply because the project was in contention with some residents. Once they got clearance, then they could start work... behind schedule.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c618137</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c618137</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:56:54 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Mark</title>
<description><![CDATA[
I've been living in the area, about one block north of St. Clair for about 20 years. Besides the process being complete corrupted, the result, if the completed section from Vaughan to Bathurst is any indication, will be worse for local merchants and local residents. Sidewalks are narrower, and the reduction in available on-street parking has made for nothing but increased traffic tickets in front of the Shoppers, for instance. But, worst of all, is the increase in traffic density along the narrowed roadway, and the streets that feed St. Clair. Because of the lack of objective thinking on the part of "City Staff" and anti-car politicians, the EXACT OPPOSITE of the desired effect is occurring: greater density of traffic, and less safety for pedestrians (I walk most places, so I know whereof I speak). 

As for the improvement in transit times, at the time, there were other alternatives proposed that would have been less expensive, easier to implement, and without the massive disruption. But they tended to be lumped into the dismissive "do nothing" category by local councillor Mihevc. 

Those who are rabidly pro-transit/anti-car at any cost, who live elsewhere in the city, I can understand your vehemence on this issue. the St. Clair ROW is an iconic hot button issue. Count me with the get-out-of-you-car crew (did I mention that I walk most places in the city). But this process has been a disgrace, and its implementation has been disgusting.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c618071</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c618071</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:18:31 PDT</pubDate>
</item>
<item>
<title>KC</title>
<description><![CDATA[
The St. Clair ROW is the reason that I bought a house in Corso Italia early last year.
Having access to transit and being reasonably close to downtown were key factors in deciding to buy here. Not to mention that this area is affordable and has a great neighbourhood feel with fantastic food.

I can understand the pain of those who have been living here for the whole duration of the construction but I think that once it's complete it will make the area more desirable for young urbanites..... and maybe (I almost daren't say it) gentrification?]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617498</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617498</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 19:24:09 PDT</pubDate>
</item>
<item>
<title>Sean</title>
<description><![CDATA[
Tear up the tracks and put bike lanes there instead.  Joking aside, many businesses are hurting because of this mess.  City hall should give them huge tax credits for this.  Don't you agree mayor miller?  Hello?]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617474</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617474</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 17:46:09 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Jeffrey</title>
<description><![CDATA[
I never quite understand what takes these projects so long to complete? Sure we have a short-ish season for construction but we have really between April to November - that is 8 months. It took just 13 months, over 1930-1931 (using 1930’s technology) to complete the empire state building. It was the tallest building in the world until 1972! I can’t fathom why is takes 3 years to lay some tracks and fix some pipes. It is complex work sure. But this really is unreasonable. If I lived on St. Claire I would demand the city give me a full accounting of the project, it’s timescales and if it has failed or met those metrics. Putting some duct tape over the completion date is insulting and flies in the face of accountable government. ]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617384</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617384</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 15:18:01 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>TokyoTuds</title>
<description><![CDATA[
Mark, I think you are dead-on with your comments, except I'd say that St. Clair is much improved by this.  But an opportunity was missed, although the political will and public support isn't there yet for what you propose.  Maybe the next line to get the treatment will be what you envision.

By the way, have you read "Carefree Cities" by JH Crawford?]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617344</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617344</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 13:42:33 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>Mark Dowling</title>
<description><![CDATA[
@Reality Check - except subways require tunnels, stations, elevators - none of which are cheap.

That said, the St. Clair "LRT" should have been Transit City Line 1 - with new streetcars, new overhead wire (pantograph compatible), double end cars (no requirement for loops, just crossovers and traffic signal priority.  A yard built in Weston between St. Clair and Eglinton could then have been the jump off point for the Eglinton West LRT.

Instead St. Clair gets the worse of all worlds, a newly rebuilt line with old technology.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617302</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617302</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 12:40:22 PDT</pubDate>
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<title>Loozrboy</title>
<description><![CDATA[
People don't go to Kipling or Donlands to shop much because there's nothing interesting there. St Clair W (like Danforth or College) has the potential to be a draw for people from outside the area... if it's easy enough to get to. I think businesses that survive the prolonged construction will ultimately benefit, especially restaurants and the like.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617290</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617290</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 12:17:56 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>David</title>
<description><![CDATA[
I'm surprised you didn't add a picture of the sidewalk being torn up from Wychwood to Rushton, with the trucks blocking the only place on the north side of the street to walk (i.e. the RoW). I got pushed into traffic last night walking over there. Good times, let me tell ya.

However, this pain will be worth the gain. It should encourage more people to hop on the streetcar vs. using cars.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617285</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617285</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 12:05:30 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Andrea</title>
<description><![CDATA[
Considering that I'm moving to this neighbourhood soon I'm anxiously awaiting streetcar availability. Glad to see the links to those restaurants. Despite negative comments about The Rushton in BlogTO's profile I'll have to check it out.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617278</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617278</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 11:57:50 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>TokyoTuds</title>
<description><![CDATA[
True, I do not live in the area, and it is really the local residents and commuters who will benefit most from the new ROW and so on.  The point I wanted to make is that this project must be done, and will be a huge benefit to the community.  I agree that the execution has a lot to be desired, and perhaps when the city does this somewhere like Broadview near my home, the process will be better.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617277</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617277</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 11:57:31 PDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>mikeb</title>
<description><![CDATA[
I think they did a crappy job in the planning and roll-out.  That said, St Clair does not merit a subway.  The numbers just aren't there.  Especially with one at Bloor and a planned underground something on Eglinton between Keele and Leslie.  Saying otherwise is just silly.

Some drivers may have avoided St Clair for various reasons, but more did not.  It was one of the only roads south of the 401 that was 6 lanes west of Yonge for most of the trip.  It was and to some degree will remain the Midtown highway.

Frankly, I am suspicious of those who say that they might come and shop in the area due to the improvement in transit. I doubt they shop at Kipling, Donlands, Vic Park or Lansdowne much.  The benefits of the ROW is for those who live in the area, especially those who commute using transit.  It also makes the planned densification along St Clair an eaiser pill to swallow.  Those are the people that will support the local stores in the future.  That's who the store owners in Corso Italia have to think about.]]>
</description>
<link>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617269</link>
<guid>http://www.blogto.com/city/2009/06/the_st_clair_lrt/#c617269</guid>
<category>Toronto, City</category>
<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 11:44:58 PDT</pubDate>
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