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Surveying Sunday's Pro-Israel Rally at Yonge and Dundas Square
In the immediate wake of Hamas's agreement to a ceasefire, some 1000 supporters of Israel's operation in Gaza took to Yonge and Dundas square on Sunday afternoon to make their voices heard. There have been numerous rallies sparked by the recent fighting in Gaza, both in support of and against the Israeli operation. Not having had the chance to witness those in person, I headed down to Yonge and Dundas to take in the sights, and speak to some of the rally-goers.
It was a mostly joyous event, with people dancing and cheering throughout the proceedings. In the midst of such jubilation and overt expressions of political belief, I was surprised at how few people were willing to speak to me on the record.
"You just want to write about how blood-thirsty the pro-Israel side is," one man said. "But did you tell about the anti-Semites at pro-Palestinian events?" I assured him that I had no such intentions, and that I was disgusted by some of the rhetoric at recent pro-Palestinian rallies. But, of course, intemperate remarks often result from inflamed passions, and this rally would be no exception.
"They didn't bomb them enough," said another man, lamenting what he deemed Israel's excessive restraint. "Israel won't be safe until they're all destroyed." Who? Hamas or the Gazans? "Is there a difference? They elected them." Isn't that the same rationale often used to excuse suicide-bombings that target Israeli civilians? "No, this is different."
Of course, not everyone was so unreasonable. I asked a woman named Michelle why she was at the event. "It is important for all of us around the world who support Israel to make our voices heard. I wish it didn't have to be this way. Things are not going well, but Israel can't just wait for Hamas to decide they're tired of launching rockets."
I asked if she was hopeful that the incoming American administration might be more successful at reaching a peace settlement. Before she had the chance to answer, an elderly gentleman injected himself into the conversation. "Obama won't help the Jews. The Muslims stick together."
Visibly mortified at hearing this laughable canard repeated by a fellow rally-goer, Michelle struck a very different tone. "Whether it's an Israeli child dying or a Palestinian child, it's horrible. But Israel can't allow rockets to strike within its borders. Hamas is what stands in the way of peace. I don't know if things will change with a new President in the White House, or even with a realignment in the Knesset, but things aren't working the way they are now."
At this point I prepared to leave, hoping to make it home in time for football. Across the street, outside Dundas station, were a handful of Jewish counter-protestors.
"It's important for us to make it clear that not all Jews support the IDF's brutality. Look at them laughing and celebrating. I don't know how they can celebrate when so many people are being killed." Perhaps the levity was in part a response to the ceasefire? "I don't think so."
Given the cosmopolitan nature of Toronto, it's not surprising that outrage over international events often spills out into our streets. We should be thankful that when we do disagree, even heatedly, we can do so peacefully.
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Shame.
Yo yo check this mo fuggin show
i own this this buildin i built
is just filled with guilt
learn some facts
you useless hacks
you make me misrable
you screable
and morga on read section 2 of Canadian charter of rights and freedom you waste of space
http://www.sprengmeister.org/nsfw/jesusishitler/
Talk crazy all you want, but I think YOU need to review the Geneva Conventions on, among other Isreali infractions, 'collective punishment'. Sad how 'Never Again' has devolved into 'Never Again to Jews (but as for the rest...)'.
Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:
a) freedom of conscience and religion;
b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;
c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and
d) freedom of association.
I never said any of these people don't deserve these rights. It just makes me sick when it is so full of hate. I just wish people from either side wouldnt want a group of people wiped off the face of the earth, those are values that we all need to have regardless of religion, race, or background. To me, thats Canadian values.
By the way, nice debate "You waste of space"
It is not like Hamas hasn't tried to injure/kill more Isrealis. I guessif Hamas was more competent or had better weapons Isreal would be justified to make the move.
The simple fact is that Isreal has a right to defend itself even if its opposition is incompetent. Think of it this way, if Quebec started launching rockets at Ottawa and claimed that they will not rest until they owned all of North America what would you expect Canada to do?
The other thing I don't understand is why this gets so much press and is much more emotionally than other much larger wars (e.g. Russia/Chechnya, Congo, Sudan, Somalia)
The worse thing is that the hammas rockets where not even strong, well not as strong as the huge kilo bombs that Israeli Jets where dropping on the GAZA..
I was in the area and noticed the event and that was the first thing I noticed. The 'Woo'ing, the cheering and the 'Israel is great's. I thought this was in <b>incredibly</b> bad taste. Who can honestly cheer when so many people lost their lives? Doesn't surprise me to read some of the ignorant comments coming out of the protesters there.
It's a shame, because it gives people the impression the entire Jewish community is of the same mindset.
More Jewish people who are against this sort of violence also need to stand up and make their voices heard.
And it's not that anyone's "labelling" the IDF's actions war crimes. They are illegal actions. This is very clear. I don't want to get into an argument about whether the response was warranted or not (or another endless debate about proportionality), but under international law, Israel committed crimes during its incursion into Gaza.
http://community.livejournal.com/our_truth_il/
The Islamic University in Gaza, where military ammunition was stored and from which territory mortars, grenades and machine gun fire were fired, was ambushed and demolished by armed people. They set the library on fire, stole the computers, blew off the buildings. People were killed, including civilians.
Questions:
a) Was this of interest for anybody outside Gaza?
b) Was there any doubt expressed the weapons were stored on the University's property?
Answers:
a) Nobody had any interest in that.
b) No. Because these were FATAH militants who destroyed the University.
Sources:
When the fighting was at its worst, members of the Presidential Guard, who are linked to Fatah and are responsible for protecting the president of the Palestinian Authority, Mahmoud Abbas, stormed onto the Islamic University campus on Feb. 1 and remained there the next day. They said Hamas fighters were shooting from the buildings and storing weapons at the university. "The Islamic University was used as a base for Hamas gunmen," said Maher Makdad, a Fatah spokesman. "We didn't attack the university because it was a university, but because gunmen were firing from there." The Presidential Guard left a trail of destruction that included significant damage to seven buildings, totaling $10 million, according to Islamic University officials. Some of the most valuable parts of the campus were singled out for attacks. Two rocket-propelled grenades were fired into the top floor of the library, setting a blaze that gutted the computer center. Science labs with expensive equipment were also burned, as was a conference center. (New York Times, February 23, 2007)
Islamic University came under attack this month, at the peak of the Fatah-Hamas clashes, which ended with nearly three dozen people dead and scores wounded. Forces loyal to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas stormed the university after claiming that Hamas was using its campus as a launching pad for mortar attacks. Virtually every building, save the campus mosque, was set ablaze. Thousands of books in the central library were destroyed. The student union hall was ransacked. Offices across campus were torched. (Philadelphia Inquirer, February 19, 2007)
Case #2.
The Al-Quds University in Gaza, where military ammunition was stored and from which territory mortars, grenades and machine gun fire were fired, was ambushed and demolished by armed people. They set the library on fire, stole the computers, blew off the buildings. People were killed, including civilians.
Questions:
a) Was this of interest for anybody outside Gaza?
b) Was there any doubt expressed the weapons were stored on the University's property?
Answers:
a) Nobody had any interest in that.
b) No. Because these were HAMAS militants who destroyed the University.
Source:
Masked gunmen believed to be with Hamas attacked Al-Quds Open University with rocket-propelled grenades, stormed the three-story building, doused classrooms with gasoline, and set them on fire. Dozens of computers were stolen, and scores more were destroyed, university spokesman Assad Keita said. (Philadelphia Inquirer, February 19, 2007)
Case #3.
The Islamic University in Gaza (the same one), where military ammunition was manufactured and stored was hit by an artillery.
Questions:
a) Was this of interest for anybody outside Gaza?
b) Was there any doubt expressed the weapons were stored on the University's property?
Answers:
a) Everybody in the World expressed their opinion on that.
b) Yes, by the same everybody from answer (a). Guess why. If you can't guess, you'll get "F" for your exam.
Questions:
a) What's your point?
b) Did you take your meds today?
Both sides in this conflict are colossal assholes.
They will never ever agree or make peace, so they can both piss off as far as I'm concerned.
Gazans are in charge of that land- Israel even left them with a hydroponic plant for growing food that could be a source of income. What do they do instead? Store bombs and rockets in there. The children are taught to hate jews on television kids shows.
People in Asdod, Sderot and Ashkelon ( mu mom's hometown) deserve not to have rockets fired at them. Palestinians recieve millions of dollars in aid - and it doesn't show. Wonder why - it's all laundered and used for bombs and weapons to kill Israelis.
If you haven't been to Israel and seen life there for yourself - do not be so quick to judge.
I am impressed that no one from the Palestinian or Muslim communities has responded with the knee-jerk intemperateness predictably shown from the Zionist lunatic-fringe: stop blogging and make 'aliya'. Just how long will it take for one of the Zionists to call my friends traitors...
I'm sure in a crowd that big, there are people full of hate, but the crowd for the most part was people who just want Israel to live in peace, and believed that the war was the only way to stop the rockets?
Are the correct? I'm not sure they are. But I'm not sure they're not, either. The point is, they have a legitimate voice, and I commend them for trying to have their voices heard.
2. If you answer the (1) with "no", then did you take your meds today?
Do you suppose Gazans (and Palestinians in general) were laughing and jubilant in response to the ceasefire? I believe they are still hauling their dead loved ones out of the rubble. Let's not impose a false equality on this situation, please.
Israel took way too long to defend itself. Israel didn't finish the job. Israel didn't inflict anything close to the damage it could have inflicted on Hamas. Israel worries more about world opinion than protecting it's citizens
Worst of all, Israel is slow to realize there's no chance of peace when a population, from birth, is inducted into nazi ideology and commitment.