Are Toronto students scared to go to school?

Posted by Sameer
Filed in City
January 11, 2008

Are Toronto schools safe for students?
Late yesterday afternoon, I had the chance to leaf through a 1,000-page document released by the Toronto School Community Safety Panel that outlined several recommendations on how to make Toronto public schools safer environments for all students.

The report, prepared by a panel led by lawyer Julian Falconer, was commissioned by the Toronto District School Board after the shooting death of 15-year-old Jordan Manners at C.W. Jefferys Collegiate Institute last year. The full findings can be obtained through the TDSB and the School Safety Panel, but many major media outlets in the city have already been analyzing the 120 recommendations in the massive report.

I didn't have a chance to get through all of the recommendations during the hour or so during which I was flipping through the document, but there was one thing that came across very strongly in the few pages I was able to peruse: going to school is a very scary experience for many students in Toronto.

Growing up, school wasn't a scary place for me. Sure, as the class bookworm I was an easy target for bullies, but there wasn't a single day when I was fearing for my life by stepping inside my school. I grew up and went to school in Rexdale — which is one of the areas of Toronto that is often cited for violence and crime — but I never felt as though my learning environment was threatening to my personal safety.

Not so much these days. The report released yesterday stated that there was an abundance of guns in our city's public schools, that sexual assault and harassment is widespread, and that some schools are breeding grounds for gang violence.

Color me naive, but apart from a few incidents that I knew of growing up, these kinds of concerns didn't cross my mind when I was going to public school in Toronto.

While this news might be frightening for parents, I applaud the Toronto District School Board for opening up and acknowledging that there is a problem. A statement released yesterday by the Chair of the Board and the Director of Education promises more accountability:

As we have demonstrated throughout this precedent-setting process, we will continue to be completely accountable and open with the public and with our staff as we moAmonve forward. Regular updates on our website and through the media will ensure that our staff, students, parents, and communities remain confident in the work that we are doing every day to support every single one of our students.

Minister of Education Kathleen Wynne also released a statement yesterday referencing the report, assuring parents and Ontario public that she "strongly believes that our publicly funded schools offer Ontario students the best education possible. Ontario's schools should be as inclusive, welcoming and safe as possible."

Among the recommendations that I was able to find in the report are measures such as school uniforms, identity cards, and new disciplinary actions. Underneath it all, however, was still the feeling that students now feared going to school.

I may have dreaded going to school some days when i was growing up, but I never actually feared for my life. Is that just me, or have schools in Toronto really changed that much? Did you get this feeling when you were growing up?

(Photo by blogTO Flickr pooler Mark.)

Gloria on January 11, 2008 at 8:41 AM

No, and I graduated from high school in 2003. I did, however, have the good fortune of going to Riverdale Collegiate in an area that, as far as I know, doesn't have the major problems some other areas of Toronto have.

Sameer Vasta on January 11, 2008 at 9:08 AM

The report says that the "culture of fear" isn't simply located in the 'problem areas' of Toronto but is instead widespread across the city. Gloria, if you graduated five years ago and didn't feel that sense, what do you think has changed in the past few years, or does the report actually have it all wrong?

Robyn H on January 11, 2008 at 9:14 AM

I never did, and I graduated from a school in the heart of Scarborough in 2005. There were a couple incidents in my first two years there, but then the school started liberally using the safe schools transfers to break up a couple of gangs (and I mean liberally, when i was in grade 10 i remember about 10 people just disappearing, not all for gang reasons). So maybe the safe school transfers work?
They stopped using the ID cards the year I graduated because it ended up being more of a hassle to issue temp ones all the time. Their best asset was two really good hall monitors ("community partners") who were more like friends to the students than authority figures. People trusted them, so they knew what was going on.

Sameer Vasta on January 11, 2008 at 9:18 AM

The report actually has a whole section on why safe school transfers aren't the best disciplinary policy and a recommendation saying they should be eliminated or reduced. Maybe they need to hear more stories like yours Robyn?

Robyn H on January 11, 2008 at 9:32 AM

The thing is, I don't know what happened after these students were transferred. We didn't seem to get many transfers ourselves. The worst of it was when I was in grade 9, after that they issued the ID cards, got the hall monitors, transferred or kicked out a bunch of people, and locked all the doors except the front ones. Of course, at the same time, we were never allowed to have dances because hiring 4 police officers was too expensive, and we had to have them after a couple of guys got jumped after a dance. But still, I never felt threatened. Then again, I wasn't in a gang or dated anyone in a gang. I think it really depends on your crowd. Which is also why I think the transfers help a bit; if you've got beef with guys at you school you're going to have to deal with it every day. At least if you're at another school, it's not every day. However, this definitely does NOT solve the root problem as it's not like they can't find you.

Ramius on January 11, 2008 at 9:38 AM

Where do parents come into this equasion? I know a bunch of high school teachers who are close friends of mine and they say that kids today have zero respect for teachers and fellow students. AND every time a teacher repromends the bad students their parents get all upset and blame the teachers for their kids bad behaviour. That plain BS to me. Instead of watching Desperate Housewives and Sports parents should actually try a little bit of parenting once in a while.

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 10:32 AM

And we have the first "where are the parents" statement. Time! Let's assume all of the parents have collectively given up...so what can we do? We've seen kids from those so-called "good families" turn into serial killers, and we've seen kids from the so-called "broken families" go on to become amazing people. If someone dumps a kid on your doorstep, you have a choice, stand there and ask where the parents are, or bring that kid in and help it now and just worry about the dead-beat parents later.
We (society and schools) are going have to redefine "families" and "parents" and what is going on at home. Is it a teachers job to raise other people's kids? No. But we're not helping our young people by just asking "where are the parents?", someone is going to have to step up and help kids learn. It can be done and it is a lot to take on, but it beats wasting time pointing fingers.
Standing around complaining about "these kids today" or "young man, where are your parents?" gets us nowhere.
That being said, as someone who graduated many, many moons ago...I can honestly say, I am very glad I am not a teen-ager now. But by all means, walk down the halls of any school anywhere and ask "where are your parents?"

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 11:22 AM

Also, there is this tendency to "want it both ways". I'm not sure how we can expect our children to behave in a certain way, when adults act like idiots. Parents buy their kids violent video games, sex and violence splashed across every medium. TV/Reality shows of alliances, double-dealing, cheating. We give our sports teams aggressive names like "WildCats", "Warriors", "Marauders". we teach people to "go out and take what is yours, no one is going to give it to you!" "Stand up, Stand out, make yourself known."
Then we act surprised when they do. "Oh, wait, no, don't do THAT".
When has a kid ever done, ANYTHING that they have not seen an adult do and get noticed or notoriety because of it? You're old man doesn't get noticed for being honest, paying the bills on time and going to work everyday, but when your old man blows up and pushes people around, he gets shit done and he gets noticed. Who do expect our kids to want to be like? Gandhi?

Rick on January 11, 2008 at 11:55 AM

I grew up in rural Ontario and went to a small quiet high school. Back then people who had a beef with each other would throw a couple punches and go home. No weapons, no gangs, just one on one. The worst thing that would happen was a black eye. I'm not saying that this is the best way to deal with things either but at least you knew that unless you provoke someone you never had anything to worry about and even if you did you'd still be going home at the end of the night. There was no fear for one's life.

Gloria on January 11, 2008 at 12:49 PM

It's possible that I simply was not in the right circles. I was not always completely aware of what went on at school, but considering how easy the atmosphere was, it's really hard to believe anyone I knew was "afraid" of going to school. Generally it seemed like a healthy environment. Even bullying wasn't that bad; I'm pretty nerdy, and I had a comfortable existence during my time there. I don't have any of the social horror stories some people have.

Robyn might have an idea there. My school, like hers, had a hall monitor ... he was a retired firefighter, as I remember, and he patrolled the grounds all day, talking to teachers and students and generally maintaining a friendly sense of order.

I haven't been back in a while, so the atmosphere may have drastically changed. I'm already told by my brother that apparently after his time (c. 2005 or so) at least the academic environment has gone a bit downhill.

Gloria on January 11, 2008 at 1:07 PM

Also, I don't feel like I can even begin to speculate what might have "changed." Even now, the idea of a crime-infested Toronto that some people sometimes peddle is not something I find a reality every day. Maybe I'm just naive, but I do feel safe in Toronto.

Like Steve, I could probably blame something like poor parenting, video games, sex, and violence, etc., but the truth is those things have been around for a pretty long time and most of the people I knew in high school were good kids -- "good" at least in the sense they weren't in gangs and didn't tote guns.

That a shooting or a rape could happen in a Toronto school is completely alien to me; it shocks me utterly. So maybe I'm too disconnected to really comment.

Sameer Vasta on January 11, 2008 at 1:16 PM

My brother graduated from high school last year, and some of the stories I heard from him were in fact shocking. Like me, my brother wasn't necessarily part of the crowd that was associated with such kinds of violence in schools, but word spread quickly and all students were in some way aware of the things going on in their school.

When I was in school, we'd hear about some of these acts, but they were isolated and shocking incidents. What bothers me is that my brother and his peers hear about these kinds of violent incidents and shrug them off as if they were normal.

I'm still finding it hard to believe things have changed so much since I left the Toronto public school system (1999) but after reading the report and talking to a lot of high school students, I'm beginning to think I may be wrong.

mogo on January 11, 2008 at 1:39 PM

You know, I think some of the lack of respect might stem from the fact that graduating from high school doesn't mean what it used to mean. Students can't fail classes anymore, kids manage to graduate without going to class. Is it any wonder that some don't take school seriously? I have friends who are teachers now and the stories I hear are just ludicrous. If you don't set some standards, stand by them and allow teachers to actually teach, all you do is reduce high school to a glorified daycare.

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 2:03 PM

It's always amazed me, the pressure to "fit in" in Canada and the USSA everyone talks about being "your own person", "think for yourself", "unique" or "one of a kind" or "special", yet, there is so much pressure to fit in or just go along with what everyone else does. We all know what happens to people who are "different" in high school.
I'm with one of the commenters above, we maybe had a fist-fight here and there...I recall someone bringing a knife and time stood still.

AH on January 11, 2008 at 2:11 PM

Steve, you're showing your age if you think that students are told to "go out and take what's theirs," etc. That approach has been found to damage children's self-esteem and is on the decline.

Singling out bad parenting, television, etc. misses the point, per usual. Poverty is the central issue here. The poorer the neighbourhood, the worse the school will be, most likely. Expecting the TDSB to solve widespread social ills seems a bit far-fetched to me.

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 2:29 PM

My point was when adults act like idiots, why would we expect our children to act any different?

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 2:36 PM

By the way...how many mass school shootings do we see in the inner city as compared to suburban schools? Dylan and Eric in Littleton,CO were hardly from a poor family.

per usual.

blik on January 11, 2008 at 2:37 PM

I think it's part of a much wider social problem and AH nails it by pointing the finger at poverty. If young people feel hopeless, powerless, and disadvantaged is it any wonder that they try to regain that power by arming themselves and acting out violently? Why do you think Toronto's poorer neighbourhoods experience a higher rate of street violence than, say, Rosedale?

I don't know the statistics around school violence by neighbourhood in the GTA but I'm willing to bet it's higher in the poorer areas.

I grew up gay in a small but comfortable town and experienced my share of bullying and teasing. But I was never threatened with physical violence or beaten up.

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 2:50 PM

"I think it's part of a much wider social problem and AH nails it by pointing the finger at poverty. If young people feel hopeless, powerless, and disadvantaged "
- So, then we should just go ahead and arrest all poor people? Well, there ya go, if you're poor, you're going to bring a gun to school. See, rich kids in the suburbs handle it much better with drugs, alcohol or by cutting themselves, bullemia or suicide. Those "disadvantaged" poor people need to catch up.
Blaming this on poverty is part of it, but also stereotypical that just poor people commit crimes. They certainly can't afford better lawyers and they get longer sentences.
I blame it more on the powers-that-be who KEEP people in poverty and won't allow people to either get help or help themselves.
So, some kids in poor schools shoot it out, no biggie, put in some metal detectors. A shooting at a suburban school and it makes national news and suddenly we have to change our laws and protect these kids...inner city kids....eh, not so much, kid, you're on your own.

AH on January 11, 2008 at 3:01 PM

School shootings and other spree killings are a different phenomenon from ordinary crime. Toronto has not had any Columbine-style school shootings, as far as I know, but has had murders inside and around schools as a result of gang activity, which is linked to poverty.

As far as your last post goes, you're misinterpreting what Blik and I are saying. That poverty and crime are linked is hardly news, nor does it indicate that poor people are "bad." All I'm trying to say here is that the underlying issues-- whether desperation, "gang culture," whatever-- are broadly outside of the TDSB's control, and whatever measures they implement will at best be a band-aid. A comprehensive anti-poverty strategy would be better, but I can't see it happening any time soon.

Steve on January 11, 2008 at 3:05 PM

A comprehensive anti-poverty strategy would be better, but I can't see it happening any time soon.

well, i agree with you on that, in fact, I see more people joining their ranks...this will get worse before it gets better.

blik on January 11, 2008 at 3:09 PM

"- So, then we should just go ahead and arrest all poor people?"

No, of course not. Nowhere in my post did I imply that that's what we should do. Get a grip, Steve.

"I blame it more on the powers-that-be who KEEP people in poverty and won't allow people to either get help or help themselves."

Well, yes. That's kind of what I was saying too when I said that poverty is the root cause of this kind of violence.

"Blaming this on poverty is part of it, but also stereotypical that just poor people commit crimes"

I didn't say only poor people commit crimes. Don't put words in my mouth.

Should I even bother trying to discuss this any further?

Mike Harris on January 11, 2008 at 4:28 PM

School violence. My budget cutting tax saving chickens are coming home to roost, 10 years later. Like clockwork.

Jenelle on January 11, 2008 at 10:35 PM

What's with the American spelling?

Sameer Vasta on January 12, 2008 at 1:31 AM

My bad on the American spelling Jenelle. I spent my early years in New York City (just before moving to Rexdale) and still have troubles shaking the spelling bug from time to time. You know, once you grow up with something, it's easy to slip back.

Lindsay on January 12, 2008 at 2:57 PM

I suspect that the report is possibly blowing the 'fear factor' of the average student a little out of proportion for dramatic effect. And who can blame the authors? They are trying to call attention to incidents, which while isolated, are nonetheless highly upsetting. If the report said "most kids seem ok, frankly", well there goes any hope of trying to solve the underlying issue, namely funding. When funding goes down across the board, it hits the kids in the poorer schools the hardest, since their PTA can't pick up the slack and pay for sports uniforms, outings, etc. Funding cuts also mean fewer teachers per class, fewer mentors, fewer hall monitors and coaches. Fewer responsible adults to identify at-risk kids and fewer programs to funnel them into to try to had the problems off at the pass. You want a boogey man? He's sitting in the big chair at Queen's Park. Has been for a generation or so.

Tabish Bhimani on January 12, 2008 at 6:15 PM

*colors you naive just for the fun of it*

But thats a good post, Vasta. I have to say, I was on youtube where they were demonstrating how guns can easily be smuggled into school. Apparently, tucking your shirt in reduces the chances of being able to smuggle weapons to school. Some schools do not even allow loose clothing because guns hidden on the belt line of the jeans may easily be missed. This kid took out about 8 guns or so from his person alone to demonstrate how easy it was to smuggle guns in. The question about surveillance (in the sense of information gathering) and the panopticon is the one I look at when it comes to stuff like this. Metal detectors and body searches, security cameras and all that jazz...just a thought...

A. Student on January 12, 2008 at 8:49 PM

As a high school student who attends an inner city downtown school, I am confident in stating that the kids who are afflicted by the violence in schools are not blind to it. There are easy ways to avoid it. They are not innocent bystanders.

The kids who are the disrespectful, blithering idiots portrayed by the media are the same as the 'adults' who are committing crimes right now.

It's not solely factor of economic status, race, or media exposure, it's their decision to be affiliated with these kinds of groups, and the status they try to keep up.

J on January 13, 2008 at 2:04 PM

If I had a nickel for every time someone called me on my use of US English, I'd have like $60.

Danielle on January 14, 2008 at 11:04 AM

For all it's worth, I grew up in Scarborough and graduated from Woburn in '03, a school lauded for it's math rankings, computer science, robotics, the gifted program, dance, drama and music...but also for being centrally located in Tuxedo Court. Gangs, weapons and drugs were common in the halls. The school instituted id cards and hall monitors who were actually a special type of (useless)cop, so we were more wary of them when they would ask us to take our baseball caps off than anything else.

I agree with 'A Student' that for the most part, in a way, avoiding the violence is about keeping your head down, but that doesn't always work. I had friends held up with knives walking from the corner store back to school at lunchtime, and thugs who beat a friend over the head with a baseball bat right after school on the FRONT LAWN. These weren't kids associated with these practices at all, they just happened to walk the wrong way or maybe bumped into somebody. School became a little more than stressful on days in particular when a guy drove by the bus stop outside our school waving a sawed off shotgun. As if bullies weren't enough.

Christopher on February 7, 2008 at 2:51 PM

I had at least twenty different routes to get home from school, both in elementary as well as in high. I was humiliated, and called names and ridiculed, and all it did was bottle my coming out deep inside of me for years. I don't know how many times I was hurt or sent to the nurse's office with a bleeding nose, and one time I was hospitalized after being shoved into a bandsaw (yeah, THAT'S RIGHT)and hand a finger on my left hand almost severed off.

Sameer Vasta on February 7, 2008 at 3:16 PM

Oh wow, all those experiences sound extreme. How did school administrators deal with it?

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